Feel free to ignore this thread, if you dislike the ideas presented. I'd rather just leave this here and forget about it than have to defend a series of ideas I formulated and coalesced into words in five minutes.
YES, I made this AFTER reading Kira's thread; This isn't an RPG idea. This is a Minecraft idea.
Proficiencies would, in the end, be laughably simple. You'd have one for each tool tier, plus fists. Bows and arrows would be a "wood" tool, for the sake of discussion. Same with fishing rods, if anyone cares to shoehorn them into one of these.
Fist
Wood Tools
Stone Tools
Iron Tools
Diamond Tools
Each would have a really simple EXP method; Break a block with a tool of that type, get one exp for that tool type; Deal damage with a weapon of that type, get an exp for that weapon type.
For each level in each stat, the tools of that type gain 1 durability. For every ten in a stat, tools of that level take -0.1 second to harvest blocks. (Not generally, but specifically to harvest blocks.) Clearly, that last one would have a cap of some sort. Mastering a tool tier would give you a bonus of ONE heart of damage with any tool of that tier.
Level Caps, EXP curves, etc, would of course need to be tested for balance, but should be generally the same for everything. Clearly, you shouldn't be able to max it with one diamond pickaxe, nor should it be incredibly hard to do with stone tools. Proficiency increases would not be announced in the HUD at all, it'd run in the background like the tracked stats... It'd even be tucked away with tracked stats and achievements on the Options menu.
My opinion on this idea: Minecraft straddles a line between Low Fantasy (Unnatural creatures, odd physics, no overt magic) and realism, with a tech level roughly that of the Iron Age, simplified for the sake of fun. This would, depending quite a lot on implementation, either be a slow, minor ramp for people dedicated to certain maps, or a wildly unbalanced mess. In any case, it'd definitely be a periphery thing that's not completely useless but hopefully not insanely overpowered.
Sorry to burst your bubble (no I'm not) but this is an RPG idea.
That said...Meh. On the fence, leaning toward no.
I'm sorry, but last I checked an RPG idea would be, say, trying to forcefully shoehorn an element ripped from a standard-issue RPG into Minecraft, such as summons or a Charisma stat.
I'm sorry, but last I checked an RPG idea would be, say, trying to forcefully shoehorn an element ripped from a standard-issue RPG into Minecraft, such as summons or a Charisma stat.
An RPG idea would be any element cut-and-pasted from the RPG genre, of which weapon proficiencies is one. And "summons" are more a Final Fantasy element than an RPG element.
And this seems mostly pointless. What's the purpose of it?
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Quote from yoshi9048 »
If this thread were a girlfriend, it'd do everything but anal.
An RPG idea would be any element cut-and-pasted from the RPG genre, of which weapon proficiencies is one. And "summons" are more a Final Fantasy element than an RPG element.
And this seems mostly pointless. What's the purpose of it?
The Elder Scrolls has summons. D&D has summons. Minecraft already has something that works like summons from both those games... They're called eggs, and when thrown they've got a small chance of summoning a chicken from the depths of chicken-hell, to... Be chicken-y. Don't pretend those glorified spells in Final Fantasy are actual summons.
And proficiencies have long since been liberated from being an RPG stat, unless suddenly all stats are automatically RPG elements, at which point about half of all action games are now Action RPGs, including Dante's Inferno, Devil May Cry, Megaman Zero... -trails off.-
And what's the purpose of achievements or tracking stats? Those add nothing to the game, except giving you something to gloat about to people who honestly shouldn't care because they honestly mean nothing. This actually rewards you for playing the game in a concrete and perceptible way that will cause you to then play the game more because the game actually did something for you.
They're called eggs, and when thrown they've got a small chance of summoning a chicken from the depths of chicken-hell
And what's the purpose of achievements or tracking stats? Those add nothing to the game, except giving you something to gloat about to people who honestly shouldn't care because they honestly mean nothing. This actually rewards you for playing the game in a concrete and perceptible way that will cause you to then play the game more because the game actually did something for you.
That isn't what eggs do. They simply hatch chickens.
What would the game do, exactly? Provide a near-insignificant durability boost, an insignificant cut to mining time, and an unnecessary damage boost?
Sounds like a waste to me.
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Quote from yoshi9048 »
If this thread were a girlfriend, it'd do everything but anal.
Trainable stats are RPG, stats in general are not. All games have some kind of statistics, whether they are monitored or not. But a monitored stat that only affects the player/his party that you train by doing certain things is an RPG element at it's core.
So yes, this is an RPG based idea. Also, I think it is fine without it. It isn't hard to kill the enemies, it isn't hard to mine, and adding proficiencies only makes the mundane and simple things easier.
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Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
Trainable stats are RPG, stats in general are not. All games have some kind of statistics, whether they are monitored or not. But a monitored stat that only affects the player/his party that you train by doing certain things is an RPG element at it's core.
So yes, this is an RPG based idea. Also, I think it is fine without it. It isn't hard to kill the enemies, it isn't hard to mine, and adding proficiencies only makes the mundane and simple things easier.
And when exactly did making mundane tasks less difficult as you do them become unrealistic or pointless?
It's pointless because everything is already simple as can be, and the benefits are insignificant besides.
The damage benefit may be insignificant, sure, but an extra 50 or 100 mines with a stone pickaxe that's now mining stone almost as fast as diamond would certainly make tedious, large-scale work much faster... A benefit that is considerable to anyone who isn't fond of mindless, grueling man-hours of slow mining on a map that really just isn't giving up any ore.
The damage benefit may be insignificant, sure, but an extra 50 or 100 mines with a stone pickaxe that's now mining stone almost as fast as diamond would certainly make tedious, large-scale work much faster... A benefit that is considerable to anyone who isn't fond of mindless, grueling man-hours of slow mining on a map that really just isn't giving up any ore.
Get a better map. Stone isn't meant to be that fast.
And could you please not PM me trying to equate the Minecraft egg with an RPG summon? It's not a summon.
You know what else is dumb? Wolves. Those made it in.
The argument means nothing; An even flow of multiple levels of tools will make this change immaterial quickly; It's literally only going to mean anything on maps with very, very sparse ores.
You know what else is dumb? Wolves. Those made it in.
The argument means nothing; An even flow of multiple levels of tools will make this change immaterial quickly; It's literally only going to mean anything on maps with very, very sparse ores.
Then why all the coding for something that is only going to matter on maps with sparse ores?
So far everyone that had time to look at this thread so no. Got the idea yet?
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I am the bone of my sword
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood
I have created over a thousand blades
Unknown to death, Nor known to life
Have withstood pain to create many weapons
Yet, those hands will never hold anything
So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works
Much better than all those other EXP threads. This makes logical sense as you would use more efficiant ways to use the pickaxe over time, so the durability would in essence increase.
P.S. Kira's thread is biased ******** anyways. I made a poll to see how many people liked it, and 50% said no. Why opinion get stickied is beyond any form of logic.
YES, I made this AFTER reading Kira's thread; This isn't an RPG idea. This is a Minecraft idea.
Proficiencies would, in the end, be laughably simple. You'd have one for each tool tier, plus fists. Bows and arrows would be a "wood" tool, for the sake of discussion. Same with fishing rods, if anyone cares to shoehorn them into one of these.
Fist
Wood Tools
Stone Tools
Iron Tools
Diamond Tools
Each would have a really simple EXP method; Break a block with a tool of that type, get one exp for that tool type; Deal damage with a weapon of that type, get an exp for that weapon type.
For each level in each stat, the tools of that type gain 1 durability. For every ten in a stat, tools of that level take -0.1 second to harvest blocks. (Not generally, but specifically to harvest blocks.) Clearly, that last one would have a cap of some sort. Mastering a tool tier would give you a bonus of ONE heart of damage with any tool of that tier.
Level Caps, EXP curves, etc, would of course need to be tested for balance, but should be generally the same for everything. Clearly, you shouldn't be able to max it with one diamond pickaxe, nor should it be incredibly hard to do with stone tools. Proficiency increases would not be announced in the HUD at all, it'd run in the background like the tracked stats... It'd even be tucked away with tracked stats and achievements on the Options menu.
My opinion on this idea: Minecraft straddles a line between Low Fantasy (Unnatural creatures, odd physics, no overt magic) and realism, with a tech level roughly that of the Iron Age, simplified for the sake of fun. This would, depending quite a lot on implementation, either be a slow, minor ramp for people dedicated to certain maps, or a wildly unbalanced mess. In any case, it'd definitely be a periphery thing that's not completely useless but hopefully not insanely overpowered.
That said...Meh. On the fence, leaning toward no.
I'm sorry, but last I checked an RPG idea would be, say, trying to forcefully shoehorn an element ripped from a standard-issue RPG into Minecraft, such as summons or a Charisma stat.
An RPG idea would be any element cut-and-pasted from the RPG genre, of which weapon proficiencies is one. And "summons" are more a Final Fantasy element than an RPG element.
And this seems mostly pointless. What's the purpose of it?
The Elder Scrolls has summons. D&D has summons. Minecraft already has something that works like summons from both those games... They're called eggs, and when thrown they've got a small chance of summoning a chicken from the depths of chicken-hell, to... Be chicken-y. Don't pretend those glorified spells in Final Fantasy are actual summons.
And proficiencies have long since been liberated from being an RPG stat, unless suddenly all stats are automatically RPG elements, at which point about half of all action games are now Action RPGs, including Dante's Inferno, Devil May Cry, Megaman Zero... -trails off.-
And what's the purpose of achievements or tracking stats? Those add nothing to the game, except giving you something to gloat about to people who honestly shouldn't care because they honestly mean nothing. This actually rewards you for playing the game in a concrete and perceptible way that will cause you to then play the game more because the game actually did something for you.
That isn't what eggs do. They simply hatch chickens.
What would the game do, exactly? Provide a near-insignificant durability boost, an insignificant cut to mining time, and an unnecessary damage boost?
Sounds like a waste to me.
So yes, this is an RPG based idea. Also, I think it is fine without it. It isn't hard to kill the enemies, it isn't hard to mine, and adding proficiencies only makes the mundane and simple things easier.
Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-discussion/suggestions/2775557-guidelines-for-the-suggestions-forum
That's about right.
And when exactly did making mundane tasks less difficult as you do them become unrealistic or pointless?
Nobody said unrealistic.
It's pointless because everything is already simple as can be, and the benefits are insignificant besides.
The damage benefit may be insignificant, sure, but an extra 50 or 100 mines with a stone pickaxe that's now mining stone almost as fast as diamond would certainly make tedious, large-scale work much faster... A benefit that is considerable to anyone who isn't fond of mindless, grueling man-hours of slow mining on a map that really just isn't giving up any ore.
Get a better map. Stone isn't meant to be that fast.
And could you please not PM me trying to equate the Minecraft egg with an RPG summon? It's not a summon.
They're more like summons than those things in Final Fantasy you yourself called "summons".
Anyway, Minecraft already has a hardy supply of RPG elements, this is not at all out of place.
Good argument PyroNox.
You know what else is dumb? Wolves. Those made it in.
The argument means nothing; An even flow of multiple levels of tools will make this change immaterial quickly; It's literally only going to mean anything on maps with very, very sparse ores.
Then why all the coding for something that is only going to matter on maps with sparse ores?
It's a waste of time.
I am the bone of my sword
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood
I have created over a thousand blades
Unknown to death, Nor known to life
Have withstood pain to create many weapons
Yet, those hands will never hold anything
So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works
No, they're not.
Wolves aren't dumb. They're quite useful and fun.
Your comment about it only affecting a few maps...Doesn't help your case.
P.S. Kira's thread is biased ******** anyways. I made a poll to see how many people liked it, and 50% said no. Why opinion get stickied is beyond any form of logic.