Not only do the terms blacklist and whitelist that one color is better than the other, but they are also mostly ambiguous metaphors.
Many corporations including Google-made Chrome & Chromium as well as Microsoft-owned GitHub are replacing all instances of 'blacklist' with 'blocklist' and 'whitelist' with 'allowlist' (or other alternatives such as 'excludelist'
I do not believe this would be a difficult change to both incorporate and adapt to.
I'm open to listen to any reasons why this shouldn't happen at this point in time.
Personally I consider this just another 'PC gone mad' situation
We're told we can't use the words 'Black' or 'White' as it could be considered racist even though 'Black' can be used in a positive manner - after all have you never heard of 'Black Friday Sales' ?
Can you imagine in the future if we banned all words that could be considered 'racist' towards people from different races
Here's an example 'The Kitchen been re-plastered & we need to do a white undercoat before painting the walls yellow, & before the ebony worktops are put in'
would become something like
'The Kitchen been re-plastered & we need to paint an undercoat that is part of the visible spectrum that is at the very lightest end of the visible spectrum that is devoid of colour before painting the walls yellow, & before the .....''
Oh wait - can't even say that because the word 'lightest', 'colour', 'yellow' & 'ebony' could be considered racist.
Not only do the terms blacklist and whitelist that one color is better than the other, but they are also mostly ambiguous metaphors.
Many corporations including Google-made Chrome & Chromium as well as Microsoft-owned GitHub are replacing all instances of 'blacklist' with 'blocklist' and 'whitelist' with 'allowlist' (or other alternatives such as 'excludelist'
I do not believe this would be a difficult change to both incorporate and adapt to.
It makes perfect sense to me. Colors don't have any actual reference to enabling or disabling things outside of a VERY limited set of highly racist cultural references.
Personally I consider this just another 'PC gone mad' situation
We're told we can't use the words 'Black' or 'White' as it could be considered racist even though 'Black' can be used in a positive manner - after all have you never heard of 'Black Friday Sales' ?
You're confusing progressivism with windmill crusading. It's progressive to get rid of a reference that actually is racist and/or doesn't have any non-arbitrary or racist reason for being the way that it is. The above topic is both of these. The term "blacklist" is a direct reference to negroes not being allowed in the same spaces as "normal white folk", with the insinuation being that negro spaces aren't spaces at all. It only made sense to these people, and to us it's merely grandfathered in. We can make our language slightly less confusing to future generations if we use clear and descriptive language such as allowlist or blocklist, and if we reduce racism in the process, hey it's a win-win.
Windmill crusading often looks similar at the outset, when people proclaim to want something changed due to its racist connotations, but the difference is that they're purposely trying to find the connotation, and it's not actually there. It would be windmill crusading to take offense to calling black paint black. The paint is black, and there's nothing racist about that color. And "Black Friday" uses a much older version of black as representing something bad, as it's in reference to a catastrophe known colloquially as "Black Friday". I don't think there's anything racist in that particular one but a linguist can correct me. Either way, our usage of "Black Friday" is exclusively a reference to the past event and no longer carries any racist connotations, if it ever did. It would be senseless to ban the use of the term as it would create more confusion, since the history books will forever use the term "Black Friday" to refer to the actual event.
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It may not be very hard to do, but in the long run, it will likely be very confusing and unnecessary, depending on what they change it to. White and blacklists are not inherently racist, they're likely based on the difference between darkness and light or the fact that in older times problematic workers were written in black books as a simple identification system. Darkness has pretty much always been considered more evil than light, even before races were even known of. Even a caveman would avoid going into a dark cave, but once they get a torch they will actually try it. Darkness can also be a symbol of rejection for similar reasons, or it could be a fashion style.
Even if they were racist, you can't expect a community as large as the entire internet to all change their terminology on a whim like that. Replacing the words is more of political action and not anything that actually makes any sense in most cases. I've heard arguments that the term "Black Friday" was based on something about the slave trade, but I can't know that for sure.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember those versions that minecraft pranked us with? Specifically:
Minecraft 2.0
Minecraft 1.VR-Pre1
Snapshot 15w14a
Minecraft 3D
Those are still downloadable! Watch this video for 2.0:
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
Black Friday refers to stores having a sale to get back "in the black" actually. Used to be you recorded transactions in a ledger in either red ink or black ink to signify a surplus or deficit of income. Black ink signified you were making a profit.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
You have just started
To read the haiku that you
Just finished reading
It may not be very hard to do, but in the long run, it will likely be very confusing and unnecessary, depending on what they change it to.
Is this like how people resist switching to metric because "it's confusing"? The only thing confusing about it is how none of these people have PTSD from trying to wrap their head around the far MORE confusing way that it currently is. And you wonder why school is frustrating. Maybe we should stop catering to old dogs and actually just fix these things without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I want ocean content(thanks Möjang!), nether biomes(again thanks!!), and savanna passive mobs (meerkats incoming!?).
Is this like how people resist switching to metric because "it's confusing"? The only thing confusing about it is how none of these people have PTSD from trying to wrap their head around the far MORE confusing way that it currently is. And you wonder why school is frustrating. Maybe we should stop catering to old dogs and actually just fix these things without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change.
Trust me, I'm not the kind of person who would resist switching to the metric system. I am very adamant about how superior the metric system is. However, switching the terms is a different story because it affects only a very small part of our lives. Also, the OP didn't mention what it would be changed to, so the replacement could possibly be more confusing than what we currently have, such as if they changed it to say "villagerlist" and "pillagerlist". The current system is not very confusing either, as almost everyone knows what it means and it's almost universally standardized.
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
Maybe we should stop catering to old dogs and actually just fix these things without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change.
For the record I'm 23 (ie. hardly a boomer) and I still said what I did. Age has nothing to do with it...
"...Actually just fix these things..." It's not broken, so don't fix it."...Without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change." Disregarding the old farts piece, the problem is that you overgeneralize the problem to allow for overgeneralized solutions. Does anyone really feel offended when they crack open their Minecraft server properties file? No. The only persons who will care that the universal "whitelist" and "blacklist" nomenclatures are being used in a Minecraft server menu are people who wake up in the morning and set out to deliberately find racism where there isn't any. I have zero tolerance for that as you can probably tell from my tone, because you water down the real remnants of racism that may be left, and thus will get missed because "everything is racist." Call racism at nothing too many times, and people will stop caring.
Edit: take OP's suggestion as written: "Replace the terms 'whitelist' and 'blacklist' with more inclusive alternatives." Who exactly feels excluded by Mojang's use of these common programming terms?
You're confusing progressivism with windmill crusading. It's progressive to get rid of a reference that actually is racist and/or doesn't have any non-arbitrary or racist reason for being the way that it is. The above topic is both of these. The term "blacklist" is a direct reference to negroes not being allowed in the same spaces as "normal white folk", with the insinuation being that negro spaces aren't spaces at all. It only made sense to these people, and to us it's merely grandfathered in. We can make our language slightly less confusing to future generations if we use clear and descriptive language such as allowlist or blocklist, and if we reduce racism in the process, hey it's a win-win.
I would argue that ebony, lightest, yellow, and colour all have racist backgrounds. Some people I know certainly *do* find these terms offensive and not at all arbitrary or racially uncharged.
EDIT: It's worth pointing out that 'colour' has been claimed to be reclaimed, 'yellow' is debatable, I won't speak for that because I'm not in the position to do so as a non-Asiatic person. Ebony and lightest definitely still have uncomfortable implications, though.
'The Kitchen been re-plastered & we need to paint an undercoat that is part of the visible spectrum that is at the very lightest end of the visible spectrum that is devoid of colour before painting the walls yellow, & before the .....''
Oh wait - can't even say that because the word 'lightest', 'colour', 'yellow' & 'ebony' could be considered racist.
At the same time I don't think we're going to get to this point but who knows.
Does this really matter? Is such a change really going to do anything? I doubt changing some minor wording to avoid any references to color, not even to actual race, is going to suddenly sway the hearts and minds of old bigots, or inspire the young minds of the future (or, at least, not in the way intended).
Colors have connotation, meaning that is interpreted through culture. This is not going to be wholly eradicated, because it is how our brains work. Now, I certainly agree that there are some changes that need to be made, of course. But this is absurd.
(If you really want to read about racial conflict, look up Uighur Muslims and what they're going through at this very moment, as we debate the interpretation of colors!)
It's senseless!
0 practicallity, at most it will make people not aware of changing trems punished for using old trems, doing more harm than good, because this change does no good!
Guess what, not everything black vs white is related to skin color, actually, it's much more not than it is. At least back in Poland, where it's practically never related to outside of very specific, clear context.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Dwarf gamer found:
Buildings - square, not round
Materials - from rubble mound
Dark caves - lit 'n' cleaned out
Settlements - deep underground
Farmability - to grinder bound
Shields - made creepers but sound
Axes and crossbows - taking mobs out
Should we call up every Spanish-speaking country and tell them that saying "black" ("negro") is illegal? When do we stop?
If you honestly think that the solution to historic Jim Crow is to ban the distinction between colors- not even contextually about races- today, might I suggest that you're just changing stuff for the sake of changing stuff, not attempting to achieve any meaningful goal. You can put the greatest of intentions behind what you're suggesting here, but that doesn't make the action any less counterproductive.
As Steven Crowder said recently, the BLM movement and the riots pasted all over the MSM have created more first-time gun owners, and more racists. The civil rights movement had the correct intention behind it, but now BLM blacks have taken it to the point that they demand that us whites confess our "white privilege" and pay them reparations, and if you dont they'll assault you and then burn your business to the ground... This is the progressivism that serious conservatives fight against tooth and nail at step one, and in this particular case the step one is not having Mojang change universal coding terms for everybody to accommodate one person's fragile psyche.
We've eradicated all systemic racism in the US. More trainings and "corrective measures" (ie. reparations) are ineffective and pointless at best, and will breed more racism in the younger generation at worst, so be careful what you push for.
I don't know why this thread is still here. I figured it would be taken down by now, if that's something MC forum does...
OP posted this on June 14th (2 weeks ago) and hasn't responded at all. I'm sensing a troll here...
Not only do the terms blacklist and whitelist that one color is better than the other, but they are also mostly ambiguous metaphors.
Many corporations including Google-made Chrome & Chromium as well as Microsoft-owned GitHub are replacing all instances of 'blacklist' with 'blocklist' and 'whitelist' with 'allowlist' (or other alternatives such as 'excludelist'
I do not believe this would be a difficult change to both incorporate and adapt to.
I'm open to listen to any reasons why this shouldn't happen at this point in time.
Personally I consider this just another 'PC gone mad' situation
We're told we can't use the words 'Black' or 'White' as it could be considered racist even though 'Black' can be used in a positive manner - after all have you never heard of 'Black Friday Sales' ?
Can you imagine in the future if we banned all words that could be considered 'racist' towards people from different races
Here's an example
'The Kitchen been re-plastered & we need to do a white undercoat before painting the walls yellow, & before the ebony worktops are put in'
would become something like
'The Kitchen been re-plastered & we need to paint an undercoat that is part of the visible spectrum that is at the very lightest end of the visible spectrum that is devoid of colour before painting the walls yellow, & before the .....''
Oh wait - can't even say that because the word 'lightest', 'colour', 'yellow' & 'ebony' could be considered racist.
It makes perfect sense to me. Colors don't have any actual reference to enabling or disabling things outside of a VERY limited set of highly racist cultural references.
You're confusing progressivism with windmill crusading. It's progressive to get rid of a reference that actually is racist and/or doesn't have any non-arbitrary or racist reason for being the way that it is. The above topic is both of these. The term "blacklist" is a direct reference to negroes not being allowed in the same spaces as "normal white folk", with the insinuation being that negro spaces aren't spaces at all. It only made sense to these people, and to us it's merely grandfathered in. We can make our language slightly less confusing to future generations if we use clear and descriptive language such as allowlist or blocklist, and if we reduce racism in the process, hey it's a win-win.
Windmill crusading often looks similar at the outset, when people proclaim to want something changed due to its racist connotations, but the difference is that they're purposely trying to find the connotation, and it's not actually there. It would be windmill crusading to take offense to calling black paint black. The paint is black, and there's nothing racist about that color. And "Black Friday" uses a much older version of black as representing something bad, as it's in reference to a catastrophe known colloquially as "Black Friday". I don't think there's anything racist in that particular one but a linguist can correct me. Either way, our usage of "Black Friday" is exclusively a reference to the past event and no longer carries any racist connotations, if it ever did. It would be senseless to ban the use of the term as it would create more confusion, since the history books will forever use the term "Black Friday" to refer to the actual event.
I want
ocean content(thanks Möjang!),nether biomes(again thanks!!), and savanna passive mobs (meerkats incoming!?).It may not be very hard to do, but in the long run, it will likely be very confusing and unnecessary, depending on what they change it to. White and blacklists are not inherently racist, they're likely based on the difference between darkness and light or the fact that in older times problematic workers were written in black books as a simple identification system. Darkness has pretty much always been considered more evil than light, even before races were even known of. Even a caveman would avoid going into a dark cave, but once they get a torch they will actually try it. Darkness can also be a symbol of rejection for similar reasons, or it could be a fashion style.
Even if they were racist, you can't expect a community as large as the entire internet to all change their terminology on a whim like that. Replacing the words is more of political action and not anything that actually makes any sense in most cases. I've heard arguments that the term "Black Friday" was based on something about the slave trade, but I can't know that for sure.
Remember those versions that minecraft pranked us with? Specifically:
Those are still downloadable! Watch this video for 2.0:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQdu9LKAdIU
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
15w14a is on this link:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/15w14a
1.RV-Pre1 is here:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/1.RV-Pre1
Minecraft 3D is here:
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Java_Edition_3D_Shareware_v1.34
Black Friday refers to stores having a sale to get back "in the black" actually. Used to be you recorded transactions in a ledger in either red ink or black ink to signify a surplus or deficit of income. Black ink signified you were making a profit.
To read the haiku that you
Just finished reading
How about we don't look to a videogame to change its linguistically common terms to make people who deliberately see color feel better? smh...
If they were called 'Caucasianlist' and 'Africanlist' you might have point. But how about we leave the basic colors out of this madness?
Is this like how people resist switching to metric because "it's confusing"? The only thing confusing about it is how none of these people have PTSD from trying to wrap their head around the far MORE confusing way that it currently is. And you wonder why school is frustrating. Maybe we should stop catering to old dogs and actually just fix these things without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change.
I want
ocean content(thanks Möjang!),nether biomes(again thanks!!), and savanna passive mobs (meerkats incoming!?).Trust me, I'm not the kind of person who would resist switching to the metric system. I am very adamant about how superior the metric system is. However, switching the terms is a different story because it affects only a very small part of our lives. Also, the OP didn't mention what it would be changed to, so the replacement could possibly be more confusing than what we currently have, such as if they changed it to say "villagerlist" and "pillagerlist". The current system is not very confusing either, as almost everyone knows what it means and it's almost universally standardized.
Remember those versions that minecraft pranked us with? Specifically:
Those are still downloadable! Watch this video for 2.0:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQdu9LKAdIU
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
15w14a is on this link:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/15w14a
1.RV-Pre1 is here:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/1.RV-Pre1
Minecraft 3D is here:
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Java_Edition_3D_Shareware_v1.34
For the record I'm 23 (ie. hardly a boomer) and I still said what I did. Age has nothing to do with it...
"...Actually just fix these things..." It's not broken, so don't fix it."...Without stopping to ask if some old farts are afraid of change." Disregarding the old farts piece, the problem is that you overgeneralize the problem to allow for overgeneralized solutions. Does anyone really feel offended when they crack open their Minecraft server properties file? No. The only persons who will care that the universal "whitelist" and "blacklist" nomenclatures are being used in a Minecraft server menu are people who wake up in the morning and set out to deliberately find racism where there isn't any. I have zero tolerance for that as you can probably tell from my tone, because you water down the real remnants of racism that may be left, and thus will get missed because "everything is racist." Call racism at nothing too many times, and people will stop caring.
Edit: take OP's suggestion as written: "Replace the terms 'whitelist' and 'blacklist' with more inclusive alternatives." Who exactly feels excluded by Mojang's use of these common programming terms?
I would argue that ebony, lightest, yellow, and colour all have racist backgrounds. Some people I know certainly *do* find these terms offensive and not at all arbitrary or racially uncharged.
EDIT: It's worth pointing out that 'colour' has been claimed to be reclaimed, 'yellow' is debatable, I won't speak for that because I'm not in the position to do so as a non-Asiatic person. Ebony and lightest definitely still have uncomfortable implications, though.
At the same time I don't think we're going to get to this point but who knows.
Does this really matter? Is such a change really going to do anything? I doubt changing some minor wording to avoid any references to color, not even to actual race, is going to suddenly sway the hearts and minds of old bigots, or inspire the young minds of the future (or, at least, not in the way intended).
Colors have connotation, meaning that is interpreted through culture. This is not going to be wholly eradicated, because it is how our brains work. Now, I certainly agree that there are some changes that need to be made, of course. But this is absurd.
(If you really want to read about racial conflict, look up Uighur Muslims and what they're going through at this very moment, as we debate the interpretation of colors!)
It's senseless!
0 practicallity, at most it will make people not aware of changing trems punished for using old trems, doing more harm than good, because this change does no good!
Guess what, not everything black vs white is related to skin color, actually, it's much more not than it is. At least back in Poland, where it's practically never related to outside of very specific, clear context.
Dwarf gamer found:
Buildings - square, not round
Materials - from rubble mound
Dark caves - lit 'n' cleaned out
Settlements - deep underground
Farmability - to grinder bound
Shields - made creepers but sound
Axes and crossbows - taking mobs out
Should we call up every Spanish-speaking country and tell them that saying "black" ("negro") is illegal? When do we stop?
If you honestly think that the solution to historic Jim Crow is to ban the distinction between colors- not even contextually about races- today, might I suggest that you're just changing stuff for the sake of changing stuff, not attempting to achieve any meaningful goal. You can put the greatest of intentions behind what you're suggesting here, but that doesn't make the action any less counterproductive.
As Steven Crowder said recently, the BLM movement and the riots pasted all over the MSM have created more first-time gun owners, and more racists. The civil rights movement had the correct intention behind it, but now BLM blacks have taken it to the point that they demand that us whites confess our "white privilege" and pay them reparations, and if you dont they'll assault you and then burn your business to the ground... This is the progressivism that serious conservatives fight against tooth and nail at step one, and in this particular case the step one is not having Mojang change universal coding terms for everybody to accommodate one person's fragile psyche.
We've eradicated all systemic racism in the US. More trainings and "corrective measures" (ie. reparations) are ineffective and pointless at best, and will breed more racism in the younger generation at worst, so be careful what you push for.
I don't know why this thread is still here. I figured it would be taken down by now, if that's something MC forum does...
OP posted this on June 14th (2 weeks ago) and hasn't responded at all. I'm sensing a troll here...
What exactly in not inclusive about the words 'whitelist' and 'blacklist'