Crafting recipes for items could be found in naturally generated item frames or chests placed wherever Mojang wants to place them. This could alleviate the need of a wiki to check recipes.
P.S. I would like to learn how to make this less 'vague'.
No one will play a game without seeing the info and tutorial of the game
No Support
Kind Of Useless (KOU)
Minecraft is mostly unplayable for someone who do not check the Wiki. The achievement system does alleviate the dependence of the Wiki a little, and this should remove most of the dependency.
This would be a complete waste of time to implement. Once the player knows the recipe, they'll be a waste of space from that point on. The internet is overwhelmed with tutorials and guides. If a player badly wants to know how things work, they'll just go straight to the wiki or any other guide that google throws up - this will happen with or without your item recipe things.
Crafting in MC is brainless. Once you make something, you know it forever. The only time something like this is useful is for mods like Gregtech which has stupidly complex crafting. But I don't think text descriptions is the way to do it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Cast aside your festive doylaks: dragon stuff is about to happen.
Multiplayer is lonely once you understand how it actually works.
This would be a complete waste of time to implement. Once the player knows the recipe, they'll be a waste of space from that point on. The internet is overwhelmed with tutorials and guides. If a player badly wants to know how things work, they'll just go straight to the wiki or any other guide that google throws up - this will happen with or without your item recipe things.
So in-game tutorials are worthless in every single game?
Crafting in MC is brainless. Once you make something, you know it forever. The only time something like this is useful is for mods like Gregtech which has stupidly complex crafting. But I don't think text descriptions is the way to do it.
So in-game tutorials are worthless in every single game?
Okay.
Yeahno? You kinda pulled that one out of nowhere. You didn't really give a counterargument, you just misinterpreted my post and dived straight into "You think all tutorials in any game are pointless" without covering anything I said. Honestly, there was no reason for that.
The amount of things that can be done in the game is absolutely staggering. Sprinkling some crafting recipes here and there isn't gonna lift a new player into a knowledge godhood.
Yeahno? You kinda pulled that one out of nowhere. You didn't really give a counterargument, you just misinterpreted my post and dived straight into "You think all tutorials in any game are pointless" without covering anything I said. Honestly, there was no reason for that.
The amount of things that can be done in the game is absolutely staggering. Sprinkling some crafting recipes here and there isn't gonna lift a new player into a knowledge godhood.
Figuring out the crafting recipe for an item is pure guesswork unless you check a wiki. This game does not have a 'Guide' NPC, nor will it fit at all.
Assuming every player simply go to a wiki to check stuff out, there is no need for a tutorial in any game since that player can just go to XXX wiki to find out stuff.
Your argument that 'there is a Wiki and therefore this is useless' is similar to the argument that tutorials are useless because 'there is a Wiki'.
Figuring out the crafting recipe for an item is pure guesswork unless you check a wiki. This game does not have a 'Guide' NPC, nor will it fit at all.
You say a guide NPC wouldn't fit, so why would a crafting reciple that has to be found be any better?
Assuming every player simply go to a wiki to check stuff out, there is no need for a tutorial in any game since that player can just go to XXX wiki to find out stuff.
No, that isn't what I said at all. Most other games guide you in what to do. Minecraft gives absolutely 0% guidance.
Your argument that 'there is a Wiki and therefore this is useless' is similar to the argument that tutorials are useless because 'there is a Wiki'.
My argument was for Minecraft only, not games in general. Minecraft has been out for a long time, and it's not like Mojang "forgot" to add that stuff with every update. It's pretty evident that Mojang doesn't want one to be there, given all the time they had to do so if they wanted.
For a game that's this popular, and the overwhelming amount of tutorials out there, it's much too late to add this stuff. "Alright, it's been 5 years that this game existed, now is somehow the perfect time to add guides!"
Figuring out the crafting recipe for an item is pure guesswork unless you check a wiki. This game does not have a 'Guide' NPC, nor will it fit at all.
Assuming every player simply go to a wiki to check stuff out, there is no need for a tutorial in any game since that player can just go to XXX wiki to find out stuff.
Your argument that 'there is a Wiki and therefore this is useless' is similar to the argument that tutorials are useless because 'there is a Wiki'.
I agree, crafting can be guess work at first, but that quickly becomes common knowledge.
Tutorials and a wiki site are very different, IMO.
A tutorial gives you the basics of the game. IE for minecraft, a tutorial video explaining that you should start off by punching some trees, find some coal, and make a dirt hut for your first night is all you really need. In most games, the tutorial will tell you how to move around, give you practice with basic fighting methods where applicable, and introduce you to any crafting mechanic it may have. Fallout 3 and New Vegas are good examples of this. And despite that, they do leave much unexplained, on purpose.
Ill grant you that Minecraft does have an initial, vertical cliff of a learning curve, but it almost immediately becomes a flat grassy plane once you pull yourself up. Some sort of guidance would be nice and acceptable, maybe a tutorial mode.
On the other hand, you have the Wiki. They are there for people who seek more information about the game, for things that you might not, nor should not have explained in game. Example: Guild Wars 2. Every race has a tutorial mission you must complete. It covers movement, fighting, etc. But the game has soo much more that is never explained. World bosses, legendary item crafting, jump puzzle locations/solutions. That is where the wiki comes in. People that want to know this information have a place to look it up. You can basically compare it to the old-school strategy guides that told you everything you wanted to know about a game, but instead of being in book form, its in website form.
So for Minecraft, I think it would be highly unfitting and generally detrimental to have things to tell you the crafting recipe, in game. I will say, being able to construct a log book of the recipes would be a cool idea. An index you can access in game, kinda like the lore codexes from Mass Effect, maybe in a similar style to a mod, forget its name, that let you click on an item to see its crafting recipe, and you could further select an item within there to see its recipe, if any.
Another point. Items like swords all have the same recipe format. All stairs or half blocks hare made the same, but with the different materials. So to reiterate my first point, crafting can be guess work, but it quickly becomes common knowledge. Doors are made the same way, fences as well. The only things that are particularly complex to make, are not important to gameplay as a whole, so that is where a Wiki would come in the most use.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Cast aside your festive doylaks: dragon stuff is about to happen.
Multiplayer is lonely once you understand how it actually works.
But these recipes items are NOT a tutorial at ALL. In most games with a tutorial, the hints are given in a proper order when and only as they are needed, mainly to start the game. Those recipe scroll would just be randomly found ? What an original way to handle the "tutorial" part of a game! A tad inefficient, tough. New players don't know how to even make an Axe but he finds the recipe for Daylight Sensor instead. Wow. other games with recipes use them as "requisites" to be able to make stuff, not as mere info.
And all those different recipew items would quickly clutter up the player's inventory space because different recipes wouild not stack, so you'd need a new special interface to merge them into a single recipe book and manage them. Otherwise leaving scores of different recipes in your home chests will be pretty useless. I think that you need to work a bit more on your idea.
Mojang basically officially said that the official wiki is actually "part of" the game, and doesn't plan to make an in-game tutorial, so his suggestion is pretty much destined to fall into The Void pit.
However, I'd like for something like this:
#1 - The recipes items would depict the recipe using the icon images, not text, (of course). Original poster: Don't be too lazy. Edit your image so that it really shows off what it would look like. Using a simple Paint program to cut & paste one recipe straight into the other "bigger" image ain't hard to do. Also, the basic recipe icon should look different than plain paper, at least change the item color to something else ! Again, very easy to do with most Paint programs. I'd use a kind of parchement-color scroll icon instead of white paper.
#2 - *Maybe* those scrolls could ALSO be crafted, too, maybe in 2 states like blank maps / maps: you'd use the Enchantment table to spend levels and lapis to make a recipe scroll from a blank scroll.
#3 - A bit like in the Not Enough Items mod, the inventory screen would have a filter showing you the recipes you know. All new players would also know a few basic recipes. Achievements or specific in-game events (breaking a spewcific block or pickup up a specific item or crafting a specific recipe or even maybe getting killed by a specifc mob or going to a specific dimension!) could/would also "unlock" more recipes. Some recipes, you would not learn at all until you "read" the relevant recipe item. You'd aso be able to see easily which recipe you know and which you still don't know.
#4 - Right-clicking a recipe would use it up, and then you learn a random recipe. Instead of having TONS of recipe items, you 'd have only the one recipe item and you'd tend to learn a new recipe, but as you are nearing completion of knowing all recipes, it would work less and less often (but never going to "1 chance is 100". Eventually you'd earn the "Know it all" achievement or something like that. Even at the start of a new game you would still have recipe failure because "too advanced" recipe results would also make the recipe scroll reading a failure. Some recipes would be learned only whn you find special structures (or, if the structure can't be found, merely finding the relevant biome, and if biomes are off then directly for free as soon as you craft the recipes that are "before" it in the tech tree - mostly the relevant ingredients).
#5 - In any case, no recipe needed for most "obvious" basic stuff, you would already know them or learn them automatically as you play the game.
#6 - In creative, you always know all recipes. Using cheats, player or server admins can turn recipes on (can craft only what you know) or off (like current vanilla)
If the idea is ONLY to show the recipes to players but players can still craft them anyway with or without finding the recipes i.e. not actual gameplay change, then meh - the wiki is way better or else simply use an excellent mod like Not Enogh Items mod.
This isn't worth the time to code. MC is not a game in which the game teaches you how to play. If players need this, they look online for info. It isn't that hard.
Crafting recipes for items could be found in naturally generated item frames or chests placed wherever Mojang wants to place them. This could alleviate the need of a wiki to check recipes.
P.S. I would like to learn how to make this less 'vague'.
Remind me why the Minecraft community cannot comprehend anything more complicated than clicking a button.
No Support
Kind Of Useless (KOU)
See All The Collections Of Minecraft Journals!
http://www.minecraft.../#entry30669911
And Remember To Keep Every Journals Alive!
Minecraft is mostly unplayable for someone who do not check the Wiki. The achievement system does alleviate the dependence of the Wiki a little, and this should remove most of the dependency.
This is mostly a feature for new players.
Remind me why the Minecraft community cannot comprehend anything more complicated than clicking a button.
People could just look up the recipe on The Minecraft Wiki.
I have a special ability to change colors, I can change into just about any Color.
I got this special ability from eating a Grand Star.
Cast aside your festive doylaks: dragon stuff is about to happen.
Multiplayer is lonely once you understand how it actually works.
Alpha 1.0.4
So in-game tutorials are worthless in every single game?
Okay.
The text is a placeholder.
Remind me why the Minecraft community cannot comprehend anything more complicated than clicking a button.
Yeahno? You kinda pulled that one out of nowhere. You didn't really give a counterargument, you just misinterpreted my post and dived straight into "You think all tutorials in any game are pointless" without covering anything I said. Honestly, there was no reason for that.
The amount of things that can be done in the game is absolutely staggering. Sprinkling some crafting recipes here and there isn't gonna lift a new player into a knowledge godhood.
Figuring out the crafting recipe for an item is pure guesswork unless you check a wiki. This game does not have a 'Guide' NPC, nor will it fit at all.
Assuming every player simply go to a wiki to check stuff out, there is no need for a tutorial in any game since that player can just go to XXX wiki to find out stuff.
Your argument that 'there is a Wiki and therefore this is useless' is similar to the argument that tutorials are useless because 'there is a Wiki'.
Remind me why the Minecraft community cannot comprehend anything more complicated than clicking a button.
You say a guide NPC wouldn't fit, so why would a crafting reciple that has to be found be any better?
No, that isn't what I said at all. Most other games guide you in what to do. Minecraft gives absolutely 0% guidance.
My argument was for Minecraft only, not games in general. Minecraft has been out for a long time, and it's not like Mojang "forgot" to add that stuff with every update. It's pretty evident that Mojang doesn't want one to be there, given all the time they had to do so if they wanted.
For a game that's this popular, and the overwhelming amount of tutorials out there, it's much too late to add this stuff. "Alright, it's been 5 years that this game existed, now is somehow the perfect time to add guides!"
I agree, crafting can be guess work at first, but that quickly becomes common knowledge.
Tutorials and a wiki site are very different, IMO.
A tutorial gives you the basics of the game. IE for minecraft, a tutorial video explaining that you should start off by punching some trees, find some coal, and make a dirt hut for your first night is all you really need. In most games, the tutorial will tell you how to move around, give you practice with basic fighting methods where applicable, and introduce you to any crafting mechanic it may have. Fallout 3 and New Vegas are good examples of this. And despite that, they do leave much unexplained, on purpose.
Ill grant you that Minecraft does have an initial, vertical cliff of a learning curve, but it almost immediately becomes a flat grassy plane once you pull yourself up. Some sort of guidance would be nice and acceptable, maybe a tutorial mode.
On the other hand, you have the Wiki. They are there for people who seek more information about the game, for things that you might not, nor should not have explained in game. Example: Guild Wars 2. Every race has a tutorial mission you must complete. It covers movement, fighting, etc. But the game has soo much more that is never explained. World bosses, legendary item crafting, jump puzzle locations/solutions. That is where the wiki comes in. People that want to know this information have a place to look it up. You can basically compare it to the old-school strategy guides that told you everything you wanted to know about a game, but instead of being in book form, its in website form.
So for Minecraft, I think it would be highly unfitting and generally detrimental to have things to tell you the crafting recipe, in game. I will say, being able to construct a log book of the recipes would be a cool idea. An index you can access in game, kinda like the lore codexes from Mass Effect, maybe in a similar style to a mod, forget its name, that let you click on an item to see its crafting recipe, and you could further select an item within there to see its recipe, if any.
Another point. Items like swords all have the same recipe format. All stairs or half blocks hare made the same, but with the different materials. So to reiterate my first point, crafting can be guess work, but it quickly becomes common knowledge. Doors are made the same way, fences as well. The only things that are particularly complex to make, are not important to gameplay as a whole, so that is where a Wiki would come in the most use.
Cast aside your festive doylaks: dragon stuff is about to happen.
Multiplayer is lonely once you understand how it actually works.
Alpha 1.0.4
And all those different recipew items would quickly clutter up the player's inventory space because different recipes wouild not stack, so you'd need a new special interface to merge them into a single recipe book and manage them. Otherwise leaving scores of different recipes in your home chests will be pretty useless. I think that you need to work a bit more on your idea.
Mojang basically officially said that the official wiki is actually "part of" the game, and doesn't plan to make an in-game tutorial, so his suggestion is pretty much destined to fall into The Void pit.
However, I'd like for something like this:
#1 - The recipes items would depict the recipe using the icon images, not text, (of course). Original poster: Don't be too lazy. Edit your image so that it really shows off what it would look like. Using a simple Paint program to cut & paste one recipe straight into the other "bigger" image ain't hard to do. Also, the basic recipe icon should look different than plain paper, at least change the item color to something else ! Again, very easy to do with most Paint programs. I'd use a kind of parchement-color scroll icon instead of white paper.
#2 - *Maybe* those scrolls could ALSO be crafted, too, maybe in 2 states like blank maps / maps: you'd use the Enchantment table to spend levels and lapis to make a recipe scroll from a blank scroll.
#3 - A bit like in the Not Enough Items mod, the inventory screen would have a filter showing you the recipes you know. All new players would also know a few basic recipes. Achievements or specific in-game events (breaking a spewcific block or pickup up a specific item or crafting a specific recipe or even maybe getting killed by a specifc mob or going to a specific dimension!) could/would also "unlock" more recipes. Some recipes, you would not learn at all until you "read" the relevant recipe item. You'd aso be able to see easily which recipe you know and which you still don't know.
#4 - Right-clicking a recipe would use it up, and then you learn a random recipe. Instead of having TONS of recipe items, you 'd have only the one recipe item and you'd tend to learn a new recipe, but as you are nearing completion of knowing all recipes, it would work less and less often (but never going to "1 chance is 100". Eventually you'd earn the "Know it all" achievement or something like that. Even at the start of a new game you would still have recipe failure because "too advanced" recipe results would also make the recipe scroll reading a failure. Some recipes would be learned only whn you find special structures (or, if the structure can't be found, merely finding the relevant biome, and if biomes are off then directly for free as soon as you craft the recipes that are "before" it in the tech tree - mostly the relevant ingredients).
#5 - In any case, no recipe needed for most "obvious" basic stuff, you would already know them or learn them automatically as you play the game.
#6 - In creative, you always know all recipes. Using cheats, player or server admins can turn recipes on (can craft only what you know) or off (like current vanilla)
If the idea is ONLY to show the recipes to players but players can still craft them anyway with or without finding the recipes i.e. not actual gameplay change, then meh - the wiki is way better or else simply use an excellent mod like Not Enogh Items mod.
This isn't worth the time to code. MC is not a game in which the game teaches you how to play. If players need this, they look online for info. It isn't that hard.
*searches block or item name*
*clicks on wiki page*
*gets crafting recipe*
therefore...
No support