To OP, I clap. Awesome job with this thread and explaining to people why automation is amazing.
Now to my statement:
There are two main kinds of Minecraft players: the old hipster alpha players and the new 1.5 redstoning guys. I'd classify myself as a redstoner, because that's what I love to do in this game, but it seems like Mojang is attempting to make those first people who bought the game happier for nostalgia reasons, when in reality, these are the same people holding the game back from its nearly endless potential. Automation is what makes Minecraft what it is for me. I understand that the game is a sandbox, but that's what does it for me. People don't have to build these epic farms and do these epic things to make themselves feel like they've accomplished something with more work. These people who say iron farms and gold farms are "cheaty" and shouldn't be in Minecraft are living in a cave hole, because what makes Minecraft the great game that it is: the sandbox aspect. And then when they see the great creations that us redstoning people make, they become snobby and whine about not doing things not being "legit", when in truth, the most popular and most raved about things in the Minecraft community require redstone and automation. Look at Docm77, look at Etho, look at the Zipkrowd crew, look at HermitCraft, and look at the countless other popular youtubers and youtube groups. Redstone is the new age of Minecraft now. Automation in general is the new age of Minecraft.
So all of you hipster old alpha players need to understand that Minecraft has changed for the better. Go play beta 1.7.3 if you want to play legit or whatever. And Mojang, stop listening to these people who have no room for change. Redstone and Automation are the best things that ever happened to Minecraft, and breaking this amazing part ofm the game down to shambles slowly is terrible for not only 1.8, but the future of Minecraft.
In the defense of all those who didn't notice it was a joke, I only knew it was because I recognized that you were the cubic chunks guy.
But to the point at hand. . .
I have always believed in farming. One of the most amazing features of Minecraft is that anyone can play it however they want to. Someone can walk west for days, or they can dig into the ground and never face the light of day, or they can live on top of a mountain, or in a castle, or in a hell fortress under the lava lakes of the nether. Minecraft has always had open ended features, that a creative player can use to do all sorts of amazing things - one of the greatest being the ability to farm things. Farming as we know it isn't a feature of the game, it's an amazing bit of emergent game play that happens when people notice how all the little mechanics can come together to do something extraordinary.
Furthermore, the difficulty of constructing working farms should not be discounted, in most cases someone who can construct an iron farm probably has all the iron they would ever be able to use anyway - why not let them have more?
And then there is the problem of it being to late. If they had done this in Beta, fine, it's a Beta. If they had added Golems in one snapshot and nerfed in the next - fine. But once you release something like this as part of the full version of the game? That's just absurd.
Why is Mojang going to war against farmers? Why is it somehow wrong to play the game that way?
To OP, I clap. Awesome job with this thread and explaining to people why automation is amazing.
Now to my statement:
There are two main kinds of Minecraft players: the old hipster alpha players and the new 1.5 redstoning guys. I'd classify myself as a redstoner, because that's what I love to do in this game, but it seems like Mojang is attempting to make those first people who bought the game happier for nostalgia reasons, when in reality, these are the same people holding the game back from its nearly endless potential. Automation is what makes Minecraft what it is for me. I understand that the game is a sandbox, but that's what does it for me. People don't have to build these epic farms and do these epic things to make themselves feel like they've accomplished something with more work. These people who say iron farms and gold farms are "cheaty" and shouldn't be in Minecraft are living in a cave hole, because what makes Minecraft the great game that it is: the sandbox aspect. And then when they see the great creations that us redstoning people make, they become snobby and whine about not doing things not being "legit", when in truth, the most popular and most raved about things in the Minecraft community require redstone and automation. Look at Docm77, look at Etho, look at the Zipkrowd crew, look at HermitCraft, and look at the countless other popular youtubers and youtube groups. Redstone is the new age of Minecraft now. Automation in general is the new age of Minecraft.
So all of you hipster old alpha players need to understand that Minecraft has changed for the better. Go play beta 1.7.3 if you want to play legit or whatever. And Mojang, stop listening to these people who have no room for change. Redstone and Automation are the best things that ever happened to Minecraft, and breaking this amazing part ofm the game down to shambles slowly is terrible for not only 1.8, but the future of Minecraft.
I'm out.
Well that is stereo-typing in it's finest...
I've been here since a little before the nether was added, and I'm all for changing the game, it's only the minority of alpha players that want them to change it all to non-automation, and even back then you could semi-automate a lot of things, and that was what made it fun, finding new ways to automate things and getting new tech for it every update, which is even better now!
I guess all I'm saying is; don't group people like that, it's wrong.
If the developers want players to actually play, instead of sitting around afk'ing for materials, why can't they change it to reflect that? You can still have your iron farms; they didn't remove the drops, they only made it so that you have to actually kill the mob yourself. Zombies have worked this way for quite some time now, and so have experience farms. This change isn't new, it's simply been applied to more mobs.
And what happens when you set up your zombie farm and sit at it, young hunter?
Lag.
The developers aren't encouraging you to 'actually play' at all. They're making it worse for everybody around you when you do the two extra steps they've made mandatory to farming.
This isn't about players having problems with other players using farms. This is about players having a problem with the devs having a problem with extremely game-breaking farms. Anyways, farms still work. Mojang has not removed farms. They simply made iron golems and pigmen work similarly to how zombies have been for ages.
Actually, this is entirely about players having problems with other players using farms. If there were no multiplayer, there'd be no false sense of 'balance' to maintain for those who get riled over others playing the game differently and call it wrong. Farms don't break the game. The game runs just fine with them doing their thing. Heck, that's the point of farms - to get something without hurting your game. They provide a different means to acquire resources.
I think farming should be possible, but only to a certain extent. Iron Golem farms are REALLY overpowered and it kinda defeats the point of having to mine for your resources. Also, the devs will find something to counterweigh these nerfs. Look at how XP got changed after XP farms were made much harder to do and less profitable.
Let's discuss for a moment how 'overpowered' it is to let me farm iron.
You can go up to the villagers in 1.8, bust out stacks of wheat, and walk away with a handful of enchanted diamond gear. Sure, you're not getting diamonds, but you're getting what you'd make with diamonds. And they're provided as a low-hanging-fruit, a bypass to the rarest, most valuable resource in the game's overworld, for the price of wasting time on agriculture. You lose it, you just return to your wheat and then to your villagers and reclaim your enchanted diamond gear. And you're complaining that I might make myself some non-enchanted iron gear.
You do realize that 1.8 actually renders iron farms obsolete as a source of gear simply by making villager-trading better, right? There's no real need to nerf them at all, because the canny player will instead breed a couple-dozen villagers and set up a couple of agricultural farms - which can still be full-auto. The real competitive advantage lies in the newly-optimized villagers. So what are you stopping? Instead of taking a stack of iron and a few blocks of wood and making myself mundane iron gear, I should be taking my endless stacks of wheat, trading for emeralds, and getting enchanted diamond gear.
Good sir, first of all, I may inform you that I wasn't in my mother's womb in alpha minecraft.
It was a generalization. I'm not stereotyping all alpha minecraft players, I was simply generalizing the two areas. I'm not stupid. I'm very well aware of the redstone geniuses that were in alpha back then. But the majority of people then were survivors and "live off the land" kins of players because we didn't have the advanced iron and gold farms back then. Some of these awesome people made redstoning what it is today, but most people who played in alpha (those survivors) are holding back the game today from massive progression that could make it even better and improve redstone and automation even more.
I agree with you, you just misread and I didn't explain that part in enough detail. My bad on that part.
Oh the ignorance...
I would say its the other way around. It is MineCraft, not AutoGather. Sure, you can play how you want but a large amount of players play without even considering making huge automated farms, and they cry for more survival features.
Personally I am against making farms to do everything for you, but I don't care if other players do it unless it is, say, an iron farm in multiplayer PvP.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
And what happens when you set up your zombie farm and sit at it, young hunter?
Lag.
The developers aren't encouraging you to 'actually play' at all. They're making it worse for everybody around you when you do the two extra steps they've made mandatory to farming.
Actually, this is entirely about players having problems with other players using farms. If there were no multiplayer, there'd be no false sense of 'balance' to maintain for those who get riled over others playing the game differently and call it wrong. Farms don't break the game. The game runs just fine with them doing their thing. Heck, that's the point of farms - to get something without hurting your game. They provide a different means to acquire resources.
Let's discuss for a moment how 'overpowered' it is to let me farm iron.
You can go up to the villagers in 1.8, bust out stacks of wheat, and walk away with a handful of enchanted diamond gear. Sure, you're not getting diamonds, but you're getting what you'd make with diamonds. And they're provided as a low-hanging-fruit, a bypass to the rarest, most valuable resource in the game's overworld, for the price of wasting time on agriculture. You lose it, you just return to your wheat and then to your villagers and reclaim your enchanted diamond gear. And you're complaining that I might make myself some non-enchanted iron gear.
You do realize that 1.8 actually renders iron farms obsolete as a source of gear simply by making villager-trading better, right? There's no real need to nerf them at all, because the canny player will instead breed a couple-dozen villagers and set up a couple of agricultural farms - which can still be full-auto. The real competitive advantage lies in the newly-optimized villagers. So what are you stopping? Instead of taking a stack of iron and a few blocks of wood and making myself mundane iron gear, I should be taking my endless stacks of wheat, trading for emeralds, and getting enchanted diamond gear.
1.8 is making me be a better 'cheater.'
Your rebuttals didn't even make sense. Most villages don't have such nice trades, and players don't just spawn with tons of emeralds. A villager farm must be made for the best efficiency. They have nerfed villagers, in the sense that now you have to utilize all of their trades to unlock new ones. On top of that, villagers breed much less often now. As for farms causing lag, nothing is changing in that regard. Iron farms and gold farms caused just as much lag as before. I don't get why people are bringing lag into this, it has no place in this discussion.
I'm sorry, but I don't think I can discuss this further with you, since you don't seem to understand the actual mechanics behind various farms. I'm not a 'young hunter' either, I've been playing Minecraft since early beta, and I've seen a large number of mechanics added and changed. I've spent time making efficient mob grinders and material farms. I know their benefits, and their costs, and I especially know what changes they are undergoing currently. I've also had years of experience as a server operator (and owner) and grinders (materials OR experience) have always been a source of lag.
I hate when people make huge farms, have tons of resources, such as full protection IV diamond armor, or iron block houses. I mean its not right, you know? Not quite fair to people who are mining, just trying to get by with the little they have, and you have chests full of the stuff they get in a week's times.
By this logic, when people have nether portals, brewing stands, potions, and other Nether-related items, it's not fair to the people who aren't lucky enough to find diamonds and get obsidian.
Nothing is stopping those people who spend their time mining from making their own farm, except themselves. Crafting a farm is evidently a superior method of gathering resources than mining a cave. When you try and do something, you usually try for the best way of doing it. You enchant items because those enchants let you do things better. You build a farm because it lets you do things better.
I looked at this topic thinking "Is this guy joking? I hope he's joking." Turns out, 'he' was. Thanks guys, this is pretty good. It's basically /r/minecraftcirclejerk, but in this case even better!
And thanks for the lovely post of Calac!
Now please keep every user's body intact. OK, seeya.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
So I was working on this really cool resource pack a while ago, but bad progress nonwithstanding, I think I found something much better... I'm probably gonna never release another custom Minecraft map.Until we meet again...
I would say its the other way around. It is MineCraft, not AutoGather. Sure, you can play how you want but a large amount of players play without even considering making huge automated farms, and they cry for more survival features.
Personally I am against making farms to do everything for you, but I don't care if other players do it unless it is, say, an iron farm in multiplayer PvP.
I am going to be honest here. I realize minecraft is partly a survival game .. but if that is the only portion of the game you like, I can think of a handful of other games much better suited to that. I always seen minecraft as more of a building game where you first have to gather resources to build what you want to build. In general minecraft is pretty easy to survive, so it isn't much of a survival game to begin with if you ask me. I can literally box myself in and survive forever with out ever moving. Since I don't move, i wont get hungry and since I am in a box . .I wont ever die o.o.
I get more survival like fun playing Skyrim modded with realistic needs and diseases and frostfall then I ever got out of minecraft. Keeping in mind I play minecraft on the hardest setting.
If it wasn't for these amazing red stone contraption, I wouldn't even play minecraft at all. Automating tasks only means you are progressing, and it only helps you to continue to BUILD which is a main function of the game. mineCRAFT. Mineing is also a big part of the game, but I got news for you, these farms don't stop people from mining. It only stops people from mining specific ores.
No, this game is not AutoGather, but CRAFTING auto farms never made it any less Minecraft to begin with. The only people who honestly are bothered by such petty things are those with a bug stuck up their butt,
Your rebuttals didn't even make sense. Most villages don't have such nice trades, and players don't just spawn with tons of emeralds. A villager farm must be made for the best efficiency. They have nerfed villagers, in the sense that now you have to utilize all of their trades to unlock new ones. On top of that, villagers breed much less often now. As for farms causing lag, nothing is changing in that regard. Iron farms and gold farms caused just as much lag as before. I don't get why people are bringing lag into this, it has no place in this discussion.
I'm sorry, but I don't think I can discuss this further with you, since you don't seem to understand the actual mechanics behind various farms. I'm not a 'young hunter' either, I've been playing Minecraft since early beta, and I've seen a large number of mechanics added and changed. I've spent time making efficient mob grinders and material farms. I know their benefits, and their costs, and I especially know what changes they are undergoing currently. I've also had years of experience as a server operator (and owner) and grinders (materials OR experience) have always been a source of lag.
Well technically the lag issue is true. A farm that kills entities right away compared to a farm that stores them until player returns to kill them off.
Keeping entities causes more lag as the server has to keep track of more. That is common sense .. unless of course minecraft doesn't work like a conventional video game -.-
Likely because you missed the references to The Princess Bride and South Park for mild humor.
Most villages don't have such nice trades, and players don't just spawn with tons of emeralds. A villager farm must be made for the best efficiency. They have nerfed villagers, in the sense that now you have to utilize all of their trades to unlock new ones. On top of that, villagers breed much less often now.
Kindly learn how trading works in the new system before telling somebody that they're wrong. If you can't bother to experiment with it, find an article, or look up a couple of vids on youtube, the short version is that you need only sugar cane, raw chicken, and rotten meat to unlock every trade from all of your villagers - you don't need to do every trade, just one of each tier, and most include a trade costs only the emeralds you can get from trading base materials - and then you can always unlock a trade again by doing any different trade. So you walk in with stacks of wheat or raw chicken trade for several emeralds, and then trade one emerald back to unlock trading more wheat/chicken (and gain an item you probably don't care about).
Yes, they're more annoying to breed, but they're easier to get top-tier trades from, easier to unlock base-material trades against with, and much more predictable. Plus, they have set trade-lists so that you will always unlock a diamond sword/armor trade with the right villagers. If the breeding hadn't been hit hard, this would be retardedly great.
As for farms causing lag, nothing is changing in that regard. Iron farms and gold farms caused just as much lag as before. I don't get why people are bringing lag into this, it has no place in this discussion.
You say you've run a server, but you can't compare the lag of a player-kill system like a zombie/XP farm to that of a simple iron farm?
If you're that good, you should know that an iron farm with an auto-kill built in is far less processor-intensive than the horde of fifty zombies/blazes that are being allowed to pile up before using a potion to kill them. That's why lag is part of the discussion. 1.8 is turning the latter into the former.
I'm sorry, but I know it's pointless to discuss this with you further. You've demonstrated that you don't grasp the topic at hand. I am duly impressed by your ethereal credentials, though. Did you know that I'm 300' tall and breathe fire?
Likely because you missed the references to The Princess Bride and South Park for mild humor.
Kindly learn how trading works in the new system before telling somebody that they're wrong. If you can't bother to experiment with it, find an article, or look up a couple of vids on youtube, the short version is that you need only sugar cane, raw chicken, and rotten meat to unlock every trade from all of your villagers - you don't need to do every trade, just one of each tier, and most include a trade costs only the emeralds you can get from trading base materials - and then you can always unlock a trade again by doing any different trade. So you walk in with stacks of wheat or raw chicken trade for several emeralds, and then trade one emerald back to unlock trading more wheat/chicken (and gain an item you probably don't care about).
Yes, they're more annoying to breed, but they're easier to get top-tier trades from, easier to unlock base-material trades against with, and much more predictable. Plus, they have set trade-lists so that you will always unlock a diamond sword/armor trade with the right villagers. If the breeding hadn't been hit hard, this would be retardedly great.
You say you've run a server, but you can't compare the lag of a player-kill system like a zombie/XP farm to that of a simple iron farm?
If you're that good, you should know that an iron farm with an auto-kill built in is far less processor-intensive than the horde of fifty zombies/blazes that are being allowed to pile up before using a potion to kill them. That's why lag is part of the discussion. 1.8 is turning the latter into the former.
I'm sorry, but I know it's pointless to discuss this with you further. You've demonstrated that you don't grasp the topic at hand. I am duly impressed by your ethereal credentials, though. Did you know that I'm 300' tall and breathe fire?
Well to be fair ... being a server owner/operator in minecraft isn't all that amazing at all. A young kid can easily do it as far as I am aware. I set up a server rather easily, if you know how to launch a program and edit a CFG file . .you are pretty much good to go. Assuming you opened your firewall ports and all.
Not to mention with the amount of tutorials out there, it's rather a stupid thing to mention and brag about xD.
*Gloating Start* Now something to mention and brag about would be something like my Telecommunications degree and fiber optic certification ... I also have dealt with Cisco Networks and plan to get certified in that as well. *Gloating End*
Even then .. many people on the net would probably call me a liar even though im not .... but they don't know that. I could be a 12 your old kid rofl. It's the internet, Bragging is pretty stupid as it doesn't work.
Lag isn't that huge of a deal for a normal, single or double village farm, as long as you check up occasionally. It becomes a very big deal when you discuss farms like the Iron Trench or Iron Foundry, which, in the course of AFKing, will pile up golems with no real limit, much like an out-of-control mob farm. In fact, I don't even think you can build chained-village designs anymore, if what people are saying is true.
For me, I just want the old metal farms/villager breeders back.
Likely because you missed the references to The Princess Bride and South Park for mild humor.
Kindly learn how trading works in the new system before telling somebody that they're wrong. If you can't bother to experiment with it, find an article, or look up a couple of vids on youtube, the short version is that you need only sugar cane, raw chicken, and rotten meat to unlock every trade from all of your villagers - you don't need to do every trade, just one of each tier, and most include a trade costs only the emeralds you can get from trading base materials - and then you can always unlock a trade again by doing any different trade. So you walk in with stacks of wheat or raw chicken trade for several emeralds, and then trade one emerald back to unlock trading more wheat/chicken (and gain an item you probably don't care about).
Yes, they're more annoying to breed, but they're easier to get top-tier trades from, easier to unlock base-material trades against with, and much more predictable. Plus, they have set trade-lists so that you will always unlock a diamond sword/armor trade with the right villagers. If the breeding hadn't been hit hard, this would be retardedly great.
You say you've run a server, but you can't compare the lag of a player-kill system like a zombie/XP farm to that of a simple iron farm?
If you're that good, you should know that an iron farm with an auto-kill built in is far less processor-intensive than the horde of fifty zombies/blazes that are being allowed to pile up before using a potion to kill them. That's why lag is part of the discussion. 1.8 is turning the latter into the former.
I'm sorry, but I know it's pointless to discuss this with you further. You've demonstrated that you don't grasp the topic at hand. I am duly impressed by your ethereal credentials, though. Did you know that I'm 300' tall and breathe fire?
Glad we had this little talk.
It's quite clear you went into this with the purpose of tossing away everything I say in whatever ridiculous way you can come up with.
Well technically the lag issue is true. A farm that kills entities right away compared to a farm that stores them until player returns to kill them off.
Keeping entities causes more lag as the server has to keep track of more. That is common sense .. unless of course minecraft doesn't work like a conventional video game -.-
Right, but that's not happening because of the change (which is what is being argued against), that's happening because of the player refusing to keep their farm clean, isn't it?
Glad we had this little talk.
It's quite clear you went into this with the purpose of tossing away everything I say in whatever ridiculous way you can come up with.
Right, but that's not happening because of the change (which is what is being argued against), that's happening because of the player refusing to keep their farm clean, isn't it?
Yes, but Mojang should have forseen that. It's the logical thought progression. Why sit at my iron farm all day, when I can do other stuff and then kill them when I want iron? Iron Golems have 100 health, and players don't want to sit at their farm all day punching them. By that logic, iron farms shouldn't have been nerfed anyways. After all, it is the players that like automation that are refusing to play with your desires, so it should be their or a server admin's decision on whether these farms are allowed or not.
The responses in this thread illustrate well exactly what's wrong with these forums.
The OP is an awesome satire on the idiocy of "farm-nerfing" and one of the better posts on these forums in general.
And yet, half the responses are from people who obviously failed to even realize it was satire, and half of those who did manage to figure it out still don't appreciate it. These forums make me weep for our community.
The responses in this thread illustrate well exactly what's wrong with these forums.
The OP is an awesome satire on the idiocy of "farm-nerfing" and one of the better posts on these forums in general.
And yet, half the responses are from people who obviously failed to even realize it was satire, and half of those who did manage to figure it out still don't appreciate it. These forums make me weep for our community.
Completely in agreement Divinius.
And I'd be very happy to know about alternative places were we can discuss Minecraft without being called fanboys or haters based on our opinions. Or being told of the so-called Jeb's Law (perhaps the singlemost clear piece of idiocy I've come across).
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I was trying to think of a signature and this is what came up.
I don't mind auto-farms if people have come up with the design themselves, but if they've just taken it from a tutorial, they have nothing to be proud of.
But I can't tell people how to play the game, these are just my thoughts.
Where does this high and mighty attitude come from? Who says we have to play your way?
You don't like farms? Fine, don't build them. Pick a server that doesn't allow them.
Quit crying about the way other people enjoy playing and do not expect the game to change to support your narrow views.
I'm not asking that you be stopped, at all. You're entirely free to /give iron after building any mechanism you think deserves it. But Minecraft is a sim as well as a sandbox and a sim needs good, solid, reasonable rules. If a feature is introduced to give villagers some protection it shouldn't simultaneously blow up several game design goals (limited iron and reasonable villages, for starters.) And if the addition does have those effects, Mojang should make changes that undo them.
There are two main kinds of Minecraft players: the old hipster alpha players and the new 1.5 redstoning guys.
Wow, way to generalize. Just because someone doesn't build or want to build farms doesn't mean they are old hipster alpha nostalgics.
I'm personally not against farms. However, I don't use them. But, I would prefer not to be called inferior for choosing not to. Minecraft can, as many have said, be played however you want.
On topic, I don't know how to feel about this. On one hand, I don't like the idea of actively limiting the player. On the other, I feel that fixing any exploit is a step in the right direction.
Also: I don't know why there are so many people saying that people not liking farms = saying they hate every way to play but their's.
I played since Indev, and I agree completely.
But to the point at hand. . .
I have always believed in farming. One of the most amazing features of Minecraft is that anyone can play it however they want to. Someone can walk west for days, or they can dig into the ground and never face the light of day, or they can live on top of a mountain, or in a castle, or in a hell fortress under the lava lakes of the nether. Minecraft has always had open ended features, that a creative player can use to do all sorts of amazing things - one of the greatest being the ability to farm things. Farming as we know it isn't a feature of the game, it's an amazing bit of emergent game play that happens when people notice how all the little mechanics can come together to do something extraordinary.
Furthermore, the difficulty of constructing working farms should not be discounted, in most cases someone who can construct an iron farm probably has all the iron they would ever be able to use anyway - why not let them have more?
And then there is the problem of it being to late. If they had done this in Beta, fine, it's a Beta. If they had added Golems in one snapshot and nerfed in the next - fine. But once you release something like this as part of the full version of the game? That's just absurd.
Why is Mojang going to war against farmers? Why is it somehow wrong to play the game that way?
Well that is stereo-typing in it's finest...
I've been here since a little before the nether was added, and I'm all for changing the game, it's only the minority of alpha players that want them to change it all to non-automation, and even back then you could semi-automate a lot of things, and that was what made it fun, finding new ways to automate things and getting new tech for it every update, which is even better now!
I guess all I'm saying is; don't group people like that, it's wrong.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
And what happens when you set up your zombie farm and sit at it, young hunter?
Lag.
The developers aren't encouraging you to 'actually play' at all. They're making it worse for everybody around you when you do the two extra steps they've made mandatory to farming.
Actually, this is entirely about players having problems with other players using farms. If there were no multiplayer, there'd be no false sense of 'balance' to maintain for those who get riled over others playing the game differently and call it wrong. Farms don't break the game. The game runs just fine with them doing their thing. Heck, that's the point of farms - to get something without hurting your game. They provide a different means to acquire resources.
Let's discuss for a moment how 'overpowered' it is to let me farm iron.
You can go up to the villagers in 1.8, bust out stacks of wheat, and walk away with a handful of enchanted diamond gear. Sure, you're not getting diamonds, but you're getting what you'd make with diamonds. And they're provided as a low-hanging-fruit, a bypass to the rarest, most valuable resource in the game's overworld, for the price of wasting time on agriculture. You lose it, you just return to your wheat and then to your villagers and reclaim your enchanted diamond gear. And you're complaining that I might make myself some non-enchanted iron gear.
You do realize that 1.8 actually renders iron farms obsolete as a source of gear simply by making villager-trading better, right? There's no real need to nerf them at all, because the canny player will instead breed a couple-dozen villagers and set up a couple of agricultural farms - which can still be full-auto. The real competitive advantage lies in the newly-optimized villagers. So what are you stopping? Instead of taking a stack of iron and a few blocks of wood and making myself mundane iron gear, I should be taking my endless stacks of wheat, trading for emeralds, and getting enchanted diamond gear.
1.8 is making me be a better 'cheater.'
I would say its the other way around. It is MineCraft, not AutoGather. Sure, you can play how you want but a large amount of players play without even considering making huge automated farms, and they cry for more survival features.
Personally I am against making farms to do everything for you, but I don't care if other players do it unless it is, say, an iron farm in multiplayer PvP.
- Lord Tywin Lannister
Your rebuttals didn't even make sense. Most villages don't have such nice trades, and players don't just spawn with tons of emeralds. A villager farm must be made for the best efficiency. They have nerfed villagers, in the sense that now you have to utilize all of their trades to unlock new ones. On top of that, villagers breed much less often now. As for farms causing lag, nothing is changing in that regard. Iron farms and gold farms caused just as much lag as before. I don't get why people are bringing lag into this, it has no place in this discussion.
I'm sorry, but I don't think I can discuss this further with you, since you don't seem to understand the actual mechanics behind various farms. I'm not a 'young hunter' either, I've been playing Minecraft since early beta, and I've seen a large number of mechanics added and changed. I've spent time making efficient mob grinders and material farms. I know their benefits, and their costs, and I especially know what changes they are undergoing currently. I've also had years of experience as a server operator (and owner) and grinders (materials OR experience) have always been a source of lag.
...but that's just like, my opinion, man.
By this logic, when people have nether portals, brewing stands, potions, and other Nether-related items, it's not fair to the people who aren't lucky enough to find diamonds and get obsidian.
Nothing is stopping those people who spend their time mining from making their own farm, except themselves. Crafting a farm is evidently a superior method of gathering resources than mining a cave. When you try and do something, you usually try for the best way of doing it. You enchant items because those enchants let you do things better. You build a farm because it lets you do things better.
And thanks for the lovely post of Calac!
Now please keep every user's body intact. OK, seeya.
So I was working on this really cool resource pack a while ago, but bad progress nonwithstanding, I think I found something much better... I'm probably gonna never release another custom Minecraft map. Until we meet again...
I am going to be honest here. I realize minecraft is partly a survival game .. but if that is the only portion of the game you like, I can think of a handful of other games much better suited to that. I always seen minecraft as more of a building game where you first have to gather resources to build what you want to build. In general minecraft is pretty easy to survive, so it isn't much of a survival game to begin with if you ask me. I can literally box myself in and survive forever with out ever moving. Since I don't move, i wont get hungry and since I am in a box . .I wont ever die o.o.
I get more survival like fun playing Skyrim modded with realistic needs and diseases and frostfall then I ever got out of minecraft. Keeping in mind I play minecraft on the hardest setting.
If it wasn't for these amazing red stone contraption, I wouldn't even play minecraft at all. Automating tasks only means you are progressing, and it only helps you to continue to BUILD which is a main function of the game. mineCRAFT. Mineing is also a big part of the game, but I got news for you, these farms don't stop people from mining. It only stops people from mining specific ores.
No, this game is not AutoGather, but CRAFTING auto farms never made it any less Minecraft to begin with. The only people who honestly are bothered by such petty things are those with a bug stuck up their butt,
Well technically the lag issue is true. A farm that kills entities right away compared to a farm that stores them until player returns to kill them off.
Keeping entities causes more lag as the server has to keep track of more. That is common sense .. unless of course minecraft doesn't work like a conventional video game -.-
Likely because you missed the references to The Princess Bride and South Park for mild humor.
Kindly learn how trading works in the new system before telling somebody that they're wrong. If you can't bother to experiment with it, find an article, or look up a couple of vids on youtube, the short version is that you need only sugar cane, raw chicken, and rotten meat to unlock every trade from all of your villagers - you don't need to do every trade, just one of each tier, and most include a trade costs only the emeralds you can get from trading base materials - and then you can always unlock a trade again by doing any different trade. So you walk in with stacks of wheat or raw chicken trade for several emeralds, and then trade one emerald back to unlock trading more wheat/chicken (and gain an item you probably don't care about).
Yes, they're more annoying to breed, but they're easier to get top-tier trades from, easier to unlock base-material trades against with, and much more predictable. Plus, they have set trade-lists so that you will always unlock a diamond sword/armor trade with the right villagers. If the breeding hadn't been hit hard, this would be retardedly great.
You say you've run a server, but you can't compare the lag of a player-kill system like a zombie/XP farm to that of a simple iron farm?
If you're that good, you should know that an iron farm with an auto-kill built in is far less processor-intensive than the horde of fifty zombies/blazes that are being allowed to pile up before using a potion to kill them. That's why lag is part of the discussion. 1.8 is turning the latter into the former.
I'm sorry, but I know it's pointless to discuss this with you further. You've demonstrated that you don't grasp the topic at hand. I am duly impressed by your ethereal credentials, though. Did you know that I'm 300' tall and breathe fire?
Well to be fair ... being a server owner/operator in minecraft isn't all that amazing at all. A young kid can easily do it as far as I am aware. I set up a server rather easily, if you know how to launch a program and edit a CFG file . .you are pretty much good to go. Assuming you opened your firewall ports and all.
Not to mention with the amount of tutorials out there, it's rather a stupid thing to mention and brag about xD.
*Gloating Start* Now something to mention and brag about would be something like my Telecommunications degree and fiber optic certification ... I also have dealt with Cisco Networks and plan to get certified in that as well. *Gloating End*
Even then .. many people on the net would probably call me a liar even though im not .... but they don't know that. I could be a 12 your old kid rofl. It's the internet, Bragging is pretty stupid as it doesn't work.
For me, I just want the old metal farms/villager breeders back.
Glad we had this little talk.
It's quite clear you went into this with the purpose of tossing away everything I say in whatever ridiculous way you can come up with.
Right, but that's not happening because of the change (which is what is being argued against), that's happening because of the player refusing to keep their farm clean, isn't it?
...but that's just like, my opinion, man.
The OP is an awesome satire on the idiocy of "farm-nerfing" and one of the better posts on these forums in general.
And yet, half the responses are from people who obviously failed to even realize it was satire, and half of those who did manage to figure it out still don't appreciate it. These forums make me weep for our community.
Completely in agreement Divinius.
And I'd be very happy to know about alternative places were we can discuss Minecraft without being called fanboys or haters based on our opinions. Or being told of the so-called Jeb's Law (perhaps the singlemost clear piece of idiocy I've come across).
But I can't tell people how to play the game, these are just my thoughts.
I'm not asking that you be stopped, at all. You're entirely free to /give iron after building any mechanism you think deserves it. But Minecraft is a sim as well as a sandbox and a sim needs good, solid, reasonable rules. If a feature is introduced to give villagers some protection it shouldn't simultaneously blow up several game design goals (limited iron and reasonable villages, for starters.) And if the addition does have those effects, Mojang should make changes that undo them.
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Wow, way to generalize. Just because someone doesn't build or want to build farms doesn't mean they are old hipster alpha nostalgics.
I'm personally not against farms. However, I don't use them. But, I would prefer not to be called inferior for choosing not to. Minecraft can, as many have said, be played however you want.
On topic, I don't know how to feel about this. On one hand, I don't like the idea of actively limiting the player. On the other, I feel that fixing any exploit is a step in the right direction.
Also: I don't know why there are so many people saying that people not liking farms = saying they hate every way to play but their's.