People have been wanting bonemeal to be nerfed since it was first added, I say kudos to mojang for listening to the community!
...Instant tree was op as hell, When you can plant a forest in five minutes you know something was wrong, Same with immediately having a pile of bread at your disposal.
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"Only a few find the way, Some don't recognize it when they do. Some don't ever want to..." ~Cheshire cat.
I (and most people) only use bonemeal to get myself started in the beginning. At this time, I haven't killed many skeletons. Those who say that they're too easy should consider their new buff: they're almost impossible to kill without a bow and arrows, which I don't have yet. Once I have actually killed 7 skeletons (assuming each drops 1 bone on average, amount needed for one bread) I would have already gotten a stable farm established, so the bonemeal is now even more useless. I agree with a stingier crafting recipe; maybe smelting instead. However, 7 bonemeal to grow 1 wheat is absurd.
Well you have to admit that Bonemeal was a little OP...
Can you elaborate on how exactly? n__n
I personally don't see how it gave huge advantage to the game, personally. Before I found farming to be really fun, I only had small farms because it never really seemed to benefit me that much. There're plenty of cows that naturally spawn without breeding.
And I'm just talking about wheat by the way, I do agree that trees and giant mushrooms should maybe require more bonemeal as they are much larger.
I (and most people) only use bonemeal to get myself started in the beginning. At this time, I haven't killed many skeletons. Those who say that they're too easy should consider their new buff: they're almost impossible to kill without a bow and arrows, which I don't have yet. Once I have actually killed 7 skeletons (assuming each drops 1 bone on average, amount needed for one bread) I would have already gotten a stable farm established, so the bonemeal is now even more useless. I agree with a stingier crafting recipe; maybe smelting instead. However, 7 bonemeal to grow 1 wheat is absurd.
Try strafing left and right as you go over to thwack him with your sword. It'll make you a much harder to target to hit. c:
These are my thoughts. The bonemeal change is great balancing. It adds a lot to the farming aspect of the game in general. What it does is encourage actual farming, instead of just grinding a single block of farmland with a stack of bonemeal, which you can still do if you want, but, not only is it more expensive, it's now more time-consuming and labour-intensive than it used to be compared to actual farming.
What they now need, though, is to balance the actual value of the different crops. There are two aspects to the value of a crop: the effect on your hunger and the ease with which you can harvest it. Right now potatoes are too near the top of both lists and thus OP. Watermelons are already as they should be, being the easiest to harvest (the best for automatic harvesting) and also the least efficient at filling hunger, yet some people still use them because they are somewhat balanced for a matter of personal choice. What Mojang needs to do is switch the hunger value of bread and potatoes, so that bread is the most expensive and difficult to harvest but the best crop to carry and to eat, with potatoes being a bit easier and a bit less filling than bread, and carrots being somewhere in between potatoes and melons.
I also think it makes more sense for the meats to be the richest foods, since they are already the hardest to harvest, and poor people in real life often consider meat a luxury (in countries lacking the benefit of factory farms).
These are my thoughts. The bonemeal change is great balancing. It adds a lot to the farming aspect of the game in general. What it does is encourage actual farming, instead of just grinding a single block of farmland with a stack of bonemeal, which you can still do if you want, but, not only is it more expensive, it's now more time-consuming and labour-intensive than it used to be compared to actual farming.
What they now need, though, is to balance the actual value of the different crops. There are two aspects to the value of a crop: the effect on your hunger and the ease with which you can harvest it. Right now potatoes are too near the top of both lists and thus OP. Watermelons are already as they should be, being the easiest to harvest (the best for automatic harvesting) and also the least efficient at filling hunger, yet some people still use them because they are somewhat balanced for a matter of personal choice. What Mojang needs to do is switch the hunger value of bread and potatoes, so that bread is the most expensive and difficult to harvest but the best crop to carry and to eat, with potatoes being a bit easier and a bit less filling than bread, and carrots being somewhere in between potatoes and melons.
I also think it makes more sense for the meats to be the richest foods, since they are already the hardest to harvest, and poor people in real life often consider meat a luxury (in countries lacking the benefit of factory farms).
Ooo, that makes a lot of sense.
Although I actually feel that meat is pretty easy to come by in the wild if you are in the plains or forest biome. Rainforest too if animals didn't get stuck in leaves so often.
But still, I tend to feel much more full eating a steak than I do bread in rl. Perhaps meat can fill you up more, but make your character tire faster? Realistically, it makes more sense. Eating rich foods make people very sleepy.
Ok, I'm not usually not the guy complaining, although I did start a topic on how I thought the singleplayer/multiplayer merger was going to screw things royal (which, to be honest, it kinda did to a certain degree), I have to say that the Bonemeal Nerf is rediculous. So I'm going to crunch some rough numbers here and see what comes up.
2 Bonemeal + 1 Mushroom = about 20 mushrooms
2 Bonemeal + 1 Sapling = anywhere from 4-16 wood, 2-20 saplings, and 1-2 apples
1 Bonemeal + Grass Block = about 1 Rose, 2-3 Flowers, and about 12 Tall Grass
7 Bonemeal + 1 Seeds = 1 Wheat
Anyone else seeing a pattern here?
Mushrooms are almost exactly the same. Nothing special at all.
Wood got a little more costly. Not really a big deal since wood was a little "too cheap" I guess considering it only takes a few minutes to grow anyway and is useful as all get out and saplings are nature's wood makers and apples can be turned golden for awesome buffs...
Red and Yellow dyes are the same. Red and Yellow dye, put them together you get Orange so unless you got Wool to waste it on, who gives a crap.
7 times the amount as the original for 1 wheat. Is Bread getting a buff? Are we going to be seeing a massive saturation spike? Is Cake going to fill you up more? Are there going to be more animals introduced? Is Wheat going to get more uses?
If any of the answers to these questions happen to be "No." then I have to say this: WTF... It takes over a full Minecraft day for Wheat to grow normally and the number of uses for it is INCREDIBLY limited. Breeding becomes the only real use for wheat most of the time and it takes the animals, 2 wheat, and 5 minutes between breedings. It takes longer for the wheat to grow than it takes for animals to "get their breath back". Sure bones are as abundant as all get out, 0-2 per skeleton. But hostile mobs, especially skeletons, got harder to kill over the last few updates (for those of you who don't know, armor, possible enchantments, and faster shooting make skeletons the "go to" killing mob out there, they're like mini bosses now).
So in what reality does making bonemeal, something that for all it's existence in Minecraft was an instant grow "Miracle Grow", have almost no effect on wheat, an item that is almost useless most of the time and who's sole purpose is for food?
I'm not saying go back to "Insta-gro" bonemeal. I'm not telling Mojang how to do their jobs. I am saying that 2 or 3 bonemeal per wheat sounds a lot better when you think about it.
People are going to find Skeleton Spawners and make harvesting traps. People are going to play in Creative or use Cheats (also for those of you who don't know, are part of the ACTUAL game now). It's going to happen, people are going to exploit the system. Don't penalize the rest of us who play Survival on Hardcore by making food gathering reliant upon Mushroom Stew and Apples as the only practical sources. Don't take away the "Vegetarian Alternative" superfood.
Let my people, the poor miners, have their bread and above all else, "Let them eat Cake."I also forgot to add the usual bit about starting new maps and needing bonemeal to stay alive. Also, with the advent of "Murder Skeletons" this makes the nerf even more assinine. What once would have become difficult has now become nearly impossible.
I love the change. It pretty much only effects starting off, which needs to be a little harder. Is killing a skeleton which can drop up to two bones, which in return makes two bread instantly, hard? Not really. There is more than just bread to eat, go kill yourself some animals or go fishing to keep your hunger filled while you wait for your farms to get started.
Bonemeal shouldn't be an item you rely on and use all the time to grow things. Once you have a decent size farm up and running, you don't need bonemeal ever again. It's not that hard to get off your lazy bum and build a sufficient farm. I remember when there wasn't bonemeal and you had to wait everything out like a champ and that was never a problem because I made my farms sufficient enough.
I get the feeling that only the people who rely on bonemeal are upset with this change because I don't really see any other reason why this would effect you in a huge way.
Placing bonemeal on a huge-scale farm is actually a lot of work and well I don't think this nerf is too necessary. I mean one could argue that one shouldn't use bonemeal if they think it's op(making it optional while this nerf isn't optional really). I think that bones should give less bonemeal instead or only enable this on hardcore or something... idk D:.
I get the feeling that only the people who rely on bonemeal are upset with this change because I don't really see any other reason why this would effect you in a huge way.
I almost never use bonemeal except for at the very beginning. Does this mean I am to expect this won't effect me what-so-ever with all the "Murder Skeletons" out there?
Whew! And here I thought I was going to starve in my Desert, Plains, or Tundra biome on Hardcore Mode at the very beginning of a Brand New Map! WHAT A RELIEF IT IS TO REALIZE HOW WRONG I TRULY WAS!!!
I like it although I think for crops it would be better if it was like BTW bonemeal style. The good news is that dinnerbone said on his twitter that it is still a work in progress.
Alright I have an idea... Make bone meal instead of instantly increasing the growth AT ALL, it speeds up the RATE at which it grows off each use. Say, 1 use is 20% boost, 2 is a 40% boost, and 3 is a 60% boost? This way people with GOBS of bone meal will be ACTUALLY nerfed (which is what people wanted to begin with) and people staring out could still get a decent effect on bone meal for food.
Alright I have an idea... Make bone meal instead of instantly increasing the growth AT ALL, it speeds up the RATE at which it grows off each use. Say, 1 use is 20% boost, 2 is a 40% boost, and 3 is a 60% boost? This way people with GOBS of bone meal will be ACTUALLY nerfed (which is what people wanted to begin with) and people staring out could still get a decent effect on bone meal for food.
Anyone think this idea would work?
Bonemeal actually working like fertilizer?
I don't know whether to laugh or cry...
BRILLIANT!!!
You sir are the smartest of us all. And I'm not just saying that.It gives crops the plant equivalent of the Speed Buff.
I like it!Also, I cannot say this enough...
Steak and Chicken in a flour tortilla...
SOMEBODY ADD TACOS TO VANILLA MINECRAFT!!!
PLEASE!!!!!!!
Bonemeal actually working like fertilizer?
I don't know whether to laugh or cry...
BRILLIANT!!!
You sir are the smartest of us all. And I'm not just saying that.
It gives crops the plant equivalent of the Speed Buff.
I like it!
Also, I cannot say this enough...
Steak and Chicken in a flour tortilla...
SOMEBODY ADD TACOS TO VANILLA MINECRAFT!!!
PLEASE!!!!!!!
Add some wheat / water in barrels for beer with nausea wobbly effect and its a party! =D
the nerf was overdone, the 2 bonemeal per tree is ok, but the 1 bonemeal per wheat stage is insane.
Agree. If you have a skeleton farm, this is not going to change much since you will already have orders of magnitude more bones than you'll ever use.
If you don't, this makes wasting bonemeal on crops almost unthinkable.
Agree with suggestions to limit the number of bonemeal you get from one bone; or make bonemeal advance crop growth by 2 stages instead of just one.
@ fishing: I like this but many people will not. Fishing requires patience, vigilance, and paying attention to your surroundings while you're focusing on the fish. These cognitive traits aren't real strong in many of the Minecraft players I see online.
...Instant tree was op as hell, When you can plant a forest in five minutes you know something was wrong, Same with immediately having a pile of bread at your disposal.
Can you elaborate on how exactly? n__n
I personally don't see how it gave huge advantage to the game, personally. Before I found farming to be really fun, I only had small farms because it never really seemed to benefit me that much. There're plenty of cows that naturally spawn without breeding.
And I'm just talking about wheat by the way, I do agree that trees and giant mushrooms should maybe require more bonemeal as they are much larger.
Try strafing left and right as you go over to thwack him with your sword. It'll make you a much harder to target to hit. c:
What they now need, though, is to balance the actual value of the different crops. There are two aspects to the value of a crop: the effect on your hunger and the ease with which you can harvest it. Right now potatoes are too near the top of both lists and thus OP. Watermelons are already as they should be, being the easiest to harvest (the best for automatic harvesting) and also the least efficient at filling hunger, yet some people still use them because they are somewhat balanced for a matter of personal choice. What Mojang needs to do is switch the hunger value of bread and potatoes, so that bread is the most expensive and difficult to harvest but the best crop to carry and to eat, with potatoes being a bit easier and a bit less filling than bread, and carrots being somewhere in between potatoes and melons.
I also think it makes more sense for the meats to be the richest foods, since they are already the hardest to harvest, and poor people in real life often consider meat a luxury (in countries lacking the benefit of factory farms).
Ooo, that makes a lot of sense.
Although I actually feel that meat is pretty easy to come by in the wild if you are in the plains or forest biome. Rainforest too if animals didn't get stuck in leaves so often.
But still, I tend to feel much more full eating a steak than I do bread in rl. Perhaps meat can fill you up more, but make your character tire faster? Realistically, it makes more sense. Eating rich foods make people very sleepy.
2 Bonemeal + 1 Mushroom = about 20 mushrooms
2 Bonemeal + 1 Sapling = anywhere from 4-16 wood, 2-20 saplings, and 1-2 apples
1 Bonemeal + Grass Block = about 1 Rose, 2-3 Flowers, and about 12 Tall Grass
7 Bonemeal + 1 Seeds = 1 Wheat
Anyone else seeing a pattern here?
Mushrooms are almost exactly the same. Nothing special at all.
Wood got a little more costly. Not really a big deal since wood was a little "too cheap" I guess considering it only takes a few minutes to grow anyway and is useful as all get out and saplings are nature's wood makers and apples can be turned golden for awesome buffs...
Red and Yellow dyes are the same. Red and Yellow dye, put them together you get Orange so unless you got Wool to waste it on, who gives a crap.
7 times the amount as the original for 1 wheat. Is Bread getting a buff? Are we going to be seeing a massive saturation spike? Is Cake going to fill you up more? Are there going to be more animals introduced? Is Wheat going to get more uses?
If any of the answers to these questions happen to be "No." then I have to say this: WTF... It takes over a full Minecraft day for Wheat to grow normally and the number of uses for it is INCREDIBLY limited. Breeding becomes the only real use for wheat most of the time and it takes the animals, 2 wheat, and 5 minutes between breedings. It takes longer for the wheat to grow than it takes for animals to "get their breath back". Sure bones are as abundant as all get out, 0-2 per skeleton. But hostile mobs, especially skeletons, got harder to kill over the last few updates (for those of you who don't know, armor, possible enchantments, and faster shooting make skeletons the "go to" killing mob out there, they're like mini bosses now).
So in what reality does making bonemeal, something that for all it's existence in Minecraft was an instant grow "Miracle Grow", have almost no effect on wheat, an item that is almost useless most of the time and who's sole purpose is for food?
I'm not saying go back to "Insta-gro" bonemeal. I'm not telling Mojang how to do their jobs. I am saying that 2 or 3 bonemeal per wheat sounds a lot better when you think about it.
People are going to find Skeleton Spawners and make harvesting traps. People are going to play in Creative or use Cheats (also for those of you who don't know, are part of the ACTUAL game now). It's going to happen, people are going to exploit the system. Don't penalize the rest of us who play Survival on Hardcore by making food gathering reliant upon Mushroom Stew and Apples as the only practical sources. Don't take away the "Vegetarian Alternative" superfood.
Let my people, the poor miners, have their bread and above all else, "Let them eat Cake."I also forgot to add the usual bit about starting new maps and needing bonemeal to stay alive. Also, with the advent of "Murder Skeletons" this makes the nerf even more assinine. What once would have become difficult has now become nearly impossible.
Bonemeal shouldn't be an item you rely on and use all the time to grow things. Once you have a decent size farm up and running, you don't need bonemeal ever again. It's not that hard to get off your lazy bum and build a sufficient farm. I remember when there wasn't bonemeal and you had to wait everything out like a champ and that was never a problem because I made my farms sufficient enough.
I get the feeling that only the people who rely on bonemeal are upset with this change because I don't really see any other reason why this would effect you in a huge way.
HA!!!
I get it.
I almost never use bonemeal except for at the very beginning. Does this mean I am to expect this won't effect me what-so-ever with all the "Murder Skeletons" out there?
Whew! And here I thought I was going to starve in my Desert, Plains, or Tundra biome on Hardcore Mode at the very beginning of a Brand New Map! WHAT A RELIEF IT IS TO REALIZE HOW WRONG I TRULY WAS!!!
Anyone think this idea would work?
Bonemeal actually working like fertilizer?
I don't know whether to laugh or cry...
BRILLIANT!!!
You sir are the smartest of us all. And I'm not just saying that.It gives crops the plant equivalent of the Speed Buff.
I like it!Also, I cannot say this enough...
Steak and Chicken in a flour tortilla...
SOMEBODY ADD TACOS TO VANILLA MINECRAFT!!!
PLEASE!!!!!!!
Add some wheat / water in barrels for beer with nausea wobbly effect and its a party! =D
Agree. If you have a skeleton farm, this is not going to change much since you will already have orders of magnitude more bones than you'll ever use.
If you don't, this makes wasting bonemeal on crops almost unthinkable.
Agree with suggestions to limit the number of bonemeal you get from one bone; or make bonemeal advance crop growth by 2 stages instead of just one.
@ fishing: I like this but many people will not. Fishing requires patience, vigilance, and paying attention to your surroundings while you're focusing on the fish. These cognitive traits aren't real strong in many of the Minecraft players I see online.