Sorry about the misleading title, but this is science and science requires a large sample size. Specifically, I am running an experiment on those with opinions regarding the state of Minecraft terrain generation.
I Quit. Since I published my results, I have been accused over and over again of faking my results or being otherwise deceitful by the rather large army of Terrain Nazis on these forums. As such, I have decided to no longer make meaningful contributions to this community. If you wish to discuss my findings logically instead of saying "you iz stoopid cuz you iz stoopid", please feel free to PM me and I will be more than happy to discuss my findings further.
Thank you.
GAME OVER!
The experiment is completed and I have released the answers. Inside each spoiler you will find a sub-spoiler containing the version of the map. Even if you didn't vote, feel free to guess before opening the sub-spoiler!
And post your reaction!
Let's Play a Game!
Rules:
Look at the pictures in the spoilers below. Each image shows a part of a map generated using a different version of Minecraft's terrain gen system: Mid-Alpha, Mid-Beta, Large Biomes, and 1.3.1 Default.
In the poll above, vote which version you think each map was generated in. No cheating.Judge solely on the terrain and not on texture, lighting, mobs, plants, etc.
After a number of people have voted, I will reveal which picture was in which version.
Yes, there are 3 versions represented and 4 pictures. That isn't a trick. This is a control variance. Two of the images show different maps made in the same version.
Image #1:
And this map was generated in...
1.3.1, Default!
Image #2:
And this map was generated in...
Alpha!
Image #3:
And this map was generated in...
1.3.1, Large Biomes!
Image #4:
And this map was generated in...
Beta!
RESULTS and ANALYSIS:
First, Alpha. This is not terribly suprising, but the majority of voters correctly identified image #2 as being from Alpha. What I find distinctive is the stubby trees, large beaches, and few hills. This is precisely how I remember my very first map being, back when I started in Alpha 1.2.4.
Now, more interestingly, Beta! This is what inspired this experiment. I am often hearing people go on about how Beta terrain was so much better than what we get today. I also see people claim that they are wrong and just going off nostalgia. It is especially interesting to see that many voters identified image #1 as being from Beta, when, in fact, the Beta terrain was image #4. Only 29 voters said that image #4 was from Beta, while 37 voters said that image #1 was from Beta. ESPECIALLY amusing was more than a few commenting about certain flaws in image #4 that obviously made it not Beta. Some mentioned the lack of beaches, others noted the underwater geology (which is odd because I don't see anything but sand!).
Lastly, we get the 1.3.1 maps. Images #1 and #3 were generated in 1.3.1, with Default and Large Biomes, respectively. Curiously, while 30 votes were cast for #1 being 1.3.1 and 40 for #3 being 1.3.1, 39 votes were cast saying that image #4, the Beta terrain, was from 1.3.1. This suggest that more people think that Beta terrain looks like 1.3.1 terrain than 1.3.1 terrain itself does.
What does this mean? Well, to me at least, this suggests that many players actually have a hard time telling the difference between Beta and 1.3 terrain. This could be explained as being because many of the voters don't pay close attention to the quality of the terrain, but this is not the case. I saw several people comment not only their guesses, but also mention how much better the "Beta" terrain looks than the "1.3.1" terrain.
Here's my personal favorite:
NOTE: I had a lengthy PM conversation with this guy, and he is no huge fan of Beta terrain either. He is pressing for a general overhaul of the terrain, which is a perfectly valid argument
Just as a reminder, the correct answers were 1.3.1, Alpha, 1.3.1, and Beta. Note how he takes the time to point out how Beta features "instantateous drop to the water's bed" and the "crappy" beaches.
From this, and many posts and PMs similar to it, I conclude that most, though not all, players are generally unable to distinguish between Beta and 1.3.1 terrains, despite the wide number of hate posts begging for Beta's terrain back.
Disclaimer:
I have had several people, as of late, comment that I rigged the experiment by "cherry picking" images, areas, or seeds to flatter 1.3.1 terrain and make Beta and Alpha look bad. This is not true. My procedure for finding a picture was as thus:
Choose a version
Generate new map with random seed (where applicable)
Wander around in a spiral around the spawn point to enlarge the map
Open the map in 1.3.1
Take a picture of an area within sight of the spawn point that is mostly grass blocks (for consistency)
This means that I deliberately avoided deserts and jungles, NPC villages, and had to travel a noticeable distance only twice:
1.3.1 map that spawned my in a jungle.
Alpha map that spawned me in the ocean.
I created only one map per version, and made a point of trying to present each world in a single frame as accurately as I could, with the only bias being to fill the image with as much grass as I could. The Alpha map was a string of rather small islands. It was very odd. o_O
How I got the pictures:
I changed to specific version of Minecraft's terrain generation system, explored a bit to expand it, then repeated with other versions. When finished, I opened each map using 1.3.1 in Creative mode, flew around just enough to get a good picture, and then saved a screenshot. I did not use any seeds, nor did I try to make flattering shots of some versions and not-so-impressive shots of others. All pictures were taken within sight of Spawn, with the exception of 1.3.1 where I spawned next to a large jungle biome, which would have been a dead giveaway and ruined the results. Each pic specifically shows only a standard, grass biome.
You should also have users vote which terrain they prefer. You may get a case of the modern naysayer selecting the new world generation as looking the best.
You should also have users vote which terrain they prefer. You may get a case of the modern naysayer selecting the new world generation as looking the best.
That'll be my NEXT poll!
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I like the new terrain generation, and I´m pretty sure Jeb is trying hard to make it looks even better, the only think the new terrain generation needs is beaches in their full form
There was post a few hours ago that had a really nice beach that only occurs with the large biomes world type.
Well, all bodies of water are mostly bordered with sand. With large biomes enabled, that border gets spread a bit.
At least, I think that's how it happens. o_OUPDATE:
I can already see that it is not very clear-cut as to which terrain is which. I see trends in each section, as would be expected, but they are fuzzy indeed. I cannot say if these trends are correct or not, to preserve the integrity of the data.
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Can't say for certain which is which. At first I was thinking of Mid Beta as "before 1.8" but that made it impossible to categorize. All I can say for sure is that:
#1:
it has no beach. Beaches were broken in 1.8, and I <believe> 1.9. So I would have to say Beta for this one.
#2: This one is another tricky one. I'm torn between Large biomes 1.3.1 and Alpha. I don't see any "non-oak" trees, and the larger trees were more common in "Rainforest" Biomes from that time frame.
I'm going to have to go with Alpha on this one.
#3 Well this is evidently backdropped by a extreme hills, so it's either large biomes or 1.3.1 default. The center biome is sandwiched between two mountain biomes (at the very least, the one in the background and another biome below the player location, judging by the cliff), so the biome is too small for me to think it is a large biome. I'm going to go with 1.3.1 default in this one.
#4: By the process of elimination, I have to conclude that this is the large biomes 1.3.1. Nothing sticks out to argue that, for me; In fact, the river in the middle seems wider than your typical river. It could just as easily be 1.8, but that's pretty solidly defined as the first one for which beaches weren't present at all.
So, Summary:
#1:mid-Beta when beaches were broken
#2:Alpha
#3:1.3.1 Default
#4: Large Biomes
1: Beta. Process of Elimination defaults to it.
2: The grass color screams alpha, but for alpha it's awfully flat. I said 1.3.1 because it might have been from Large Biomes.
3: Alpha, although tree density is a little high. The mountains look like they are from 1.3.1 but made better with improved grass color and trees.
4: Obviously 1.3.1, the underwater geology is a dead giveaway.
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Did something happen to you in your childhood to give you this unreasonable fear of rutabaga?
There was post a few hours ago that had a really nice beach that only occurs with the large biomes world type.
the problem is that I still need to be in large biomes to have these nice beachs in my world, and I don´t usually play in large biomes. I was thinking that the second image was in beta or alpha but if the world is in large biomes them it would make more sense. And for the third image I think it is 1.3.1 because of the extreme hills biome type and them the last one... isn´t that the new gravel???
As I said, while the maps were generated by different versions, I took pictures of each by loading them in 1.3.1. This means that the lighting, mobs, textures, clouds, etc. are all 1.3.1.
The question is about the terrain itself, not the textures.
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As I said, while the maps were generated by different versions, I took pictures of each by loading them in 1.3.1. This means that the lighting, mobs, textures, clouds, etc. are all 1.3.1.
The question is about the terrain itself, not the textures.
Oh, I´m sorry for that. Judging only by the terrain generation I still think it is 1.3.1 because of the beaches that are not as complete as they were in the old generation, but it is still hard to know for sure.
Disagreeing with the title. 1.7's terrain is still superior to the crap we have now.
Problems with the current one in accordance to the pictures include:
- Mediocre excuses for beaches
- X-hills biomes makes all height changes spammed together, whereas in 1.7, you could get a cool mix of total flat land and mountains surrounding it.
- Instantaneous ocean bed drops (which could be in cooperation to the beach problem)
Image 1: 1.3.1 (very hard to tell because of mountains in the back, which is a GOOD thing, but I think that height changes only happen when in the proximity of water)
Image 2: Alpha
Image 3: Beta
Image 4: 1.3.1 (could tell because of gravel texture, instantaneous drop to the water's bed, and the crappy "beach")
Disagreeing with the title. 1.7's terrain is still superior to the crap we have now.
Problems with the current one in accordance to the pictures include:
- Mediocre excuses for beaches
- X-hills biomes makes all height changes spammed together, whereas in 1.7, you could get a cool mix of total flat land and mountains surrounding it.
- Instantaneous ocean bed drops (which could be in cooperation to the beach problem)
You didn't even read my post, did you? The title was deliberately misleading to gain the attention of people with solid opinions regarding the terrain.
I was not expecting anyone to be so dense as to see the title, skip over the poll, post, GIANT BOLD LETTERING, pictures, and sensible replies just to get his jimmies all rustled over the title.
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The Internet is a big place, friend. I've been places you've n͍̺e̩v̦e̦̰͍͓̩ͅr̜̭̝̬̬͉̤̬ ͙ịm̖͇a͍͇̤͙̥g̤̘i͔͖̤̼̪̬n͖͔̳̬̯e̩̘ḓ͈͔̠̙͇̼̯.͎
You didn't even read my post, did you? The title was deliberately misleading to gain the attention of people with solid opinions regarding the terrain.
I was not expecting anyone to be so dense as to see the title, skip over the poll, post, GIANT BOLD LETTERING, pictures, and sensible replies just to get his jimmies all rustled over the title.
I made my thoughts before voting, then used them to decide which pictures belonged to which version. It's how you can tell which version is which. Sorry, I take long to edit my posts.
I used the lighting glitch to guess that the two pictures with giant unlit areas are the most recent ones. Numbers 1 and 3 are from 1.3.1
Between 2 and 4, I was less sure and I decided 2 was alpha because of the single grass color.
Again, the lighting, terrain color, mobs, textures, and clouds are all 1.3.1. All of the pictures were taken from within 1.3.1.
The actual terrain was generated in other versions.
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I want to see how this turns out. A very interesting experiment. I have always seen why people liked the old generation but I personally hated it. I'm glad that it has changed to what it has.
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Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
I Quit.
Since I published my results, I have been accused over and over again of faking my results or being otherwise deceitful by the rather large army of Terrain Nazis on these forums. As such, I have decided to no longer make meaningful contributions to this community.
If you wish to discuss my findings logically instead of saying "you iz stoopid cuz you iz stoopid", please feel free to PM me and I will be more than happy to discuss my findings further.
Thank you.
GAME OVER!
The experiment is completed and I have released the answers. Inside each spoiler you will find a sub-spoiler containing the version of the map. Even if you didn't vote, feel free to guess before opening the sub-spoiler!
And post your reaction!
Let's Play a Game!
Rules:
Look at the pictures in the spoilers below. Each image shows a part of a map generated using a different version of Minecraft's terrain gen system: Mid-Alpha, Mid-Beta, Large Biomes, and 1.3.1 Default.In the poll above, vote which version you think each map was generated in. No cheating. Judge solely on the terrain and not on texture, lighting, mobs, plants, etc.After a number of people have voted, I will reveal which picture was in which version.Yes, there are 3 versions represented and 4 pictures. That isn't a trick. This is a control variance. Two of the images show different maps made in the same version.And this map was generated in...
Image #2:
And this map was generated in...
Image #3:
And this map was generated in...
Image #4:
And this map was generated in...
RESULTS and ANALYSIS:
First, Alpha. This is not terribly suprising, but the majority of voters correctly identified image #2 as being from Alpha. What I find distinctive is the stubby trees, large beaches, and few hills. This is precisely how I remember my very first map being, back when I started in Alpha 1.2.4.
Now, more interestingly, Beta! This is what inspired this experiment. I am often hearing people go on about how Beta terrain was so much better than what we get today. I also see people claim that they are wrong and just going off nostalgia. It is especially interesting to see that many voters identified image #1 as being from Beta, when, in fact, the Beta terrain was image #4. Only 29 voters said that image #4 was from Beta, while 37 voters said that image #1 was from Beta. ESPECIALLY amusing was more than a few commenting about certain flaws in image #4 that obviously made it not Beta. Some mentioned the lack of beaches, others noted the underwater geology (which is odd because I don't see anything but sand!).
Lastly, we get the 1.3.1 maps. Images #1 and #3 were generated in 1.3.1, with Default and Large Biomes, respectively. Curiously, while 30 votes were cast for #1 being 1.3.1 and 40 for #3 being 1.3.1, 39 votes were cast saying that image #4, the Beta terrain, was from 1.3.1. This suggest that more people think that Beta terrain looks like 1.3.1 terrain than 1.3.1 terrain itself does.
What does this mean? Well, to me at least, this suggests that many players actually have a hard time telling the difference between Beta and 1.3 terrain. This could be explained as being because many of the voters don't pay close attention to the quality of the terrain, but this is not the case. I saw several people comment not only their guesses, but also mention how much better the "Beta" terrain looks than the "1.3.1" terrain.
Here's my personal favorite:
NOTE: I had a lengthy PM conversation with this guy, and he is no huge fan of Beta terrain either. He is pressing for a general overhaul of the terrain, which is a perfectly valid argument
Just as a reminder, the correct answers were 1.3.1, Alpha, 1.3.1, and Beta. Note how he takes the time to point out how Beta features "instantateous drop to the water's bed" and the "crappy" beaches.
From this, and many posts and PMs similar to it, I conclude that most, though not all, players are generally unable to distinguish between Beta and 1.3.1 terrains, despite the wide number of hate posts begging for Beta's terrain back.
Disclaimer:
I have had several people, as of late, comment that I rigged the experiment by "cherry picking" images, areas, or seeds to flatter 1.3.1 terrain and make Beta and Alpha look bad. This is not true. My procedure for finding a picture was as thus:
How I got the pictures:
I changed to specific version of Minecraft's terrain generation system, explored a bit to expand it, then repeated with other versions. When finished, I opened each map using 1.3.1 in Creative mode, flew around just enough to get a good picture, and then saved a screenshot. I did not use any seeds, nor did I try to make flattering shots of some versions and not-so-impressive shots of others. All pictures were taken within sight of Spawn, with the exception of 1.3.1 where I spawned next to a large jungle biome, which would have been a dead giveaway and ruined the results. Each pic specifically shows only a standard, grass biome.
Thank you. I hope people don't realize I'm using them as lab rats. >:3
I wish I could request special permission to make large polls and such. The 3-question limit is killing me. :/
I'm definitely interested in seeing which is which of the pictures...
That'll be my NEXT poll!
Well, all bodies of water are mostly bordered with sand. With large biomes enabled, that border gets spread a bit.
At least, I think that's how it happens. o_OUPDATE:
I can already see that it is not very clear-cut as to which terrain is which. I see trends in each section, as would be expected, but they are fuzzy indeed. I cannot say if these trends are correct or not, to preserve the integrity of the data.
#1:
it has no beach. Beaches were broken in 1.8, and I <believe> 1.9. So I would have to say Beta for this one.
#2: This one is another tricky one. I'm torn between Large biomes 1.3.1 and Alpha. I don't see any "non-oak" trees, and the larger trees were more common in "Rainforest" Biomes from that time frame.
I'm going to have to go with Alpha on this one.
#3 Well this is evidently backdropped by a extreme hills, so it's either large biomes or 1.3.1 default. The center biome is sandwiched between two mountain biomes (at the very least, the one in the background and another biome below the player location, judging by the cliff), so the biome is too small for me to think it is a large biome. I'm going to go with 1.3.1 default in this one.
#4: By the process of elimination, I have to conclude that this is the large biomes 1.3.1. Nothing sticks out to argue that, for me; In fact, the river in the middle seems wider than your typical river. It could just as easily be 1.8, but that's pretty solidly defined as the first one for which beaches weren't present at all.
So, Summary:
#1:mid-Beta when beaches were broken
#2:Alpha
#3:1.3.1 Default
#4: Large Biomes
2: The grass color screams alpha, but for alpha it's awfully flat. I said 1.3.1 because it might have been from Large Biomes.
3: Alpha, although tree density is a little high. The mountains look like they are from 1.3.1 but made better with improved grass color and trees.
4: Obviously 1.3.1, the underwater geology is a dead giveaway.
the problem is that I still need to be in large biomes to have these nice beachs in my world, and I don´t usually play in large biomes. I was thinking that the second image was in beta or alpha but if the world is in large biomes them it would make more sense. And for the third image I think it is 1.3.1 because of the extreme hills biome type and them the last one... isn´t that the new gravel???
As I said, while the maps were generated by different versions, I took pictures of each by loading them in 1.3.1. This means that the lighting, mobs, textures, clouds, etc. are all 1.3.1.
The question is about the terrain itself, not the textures.
Oh, I´m sorry for that. Judging only by the terrain generation I still think it is 1.3.1 because of the beaches that are not as complete as they were in the old generation, but it is still hard to know for sure.
Problems with the current one in accordance to the pictures include:
- Mediocre excuses for beaches
- X-hills biomes makes all height changes spammed together, whereas in 1.7, you could get a cool mix of total flat land and mountains surrounding it.
- Instantaneous ocean bed drops (which could be in cooperation to the beach problem)
Image 1: 1.3.1 (very hard to tell because of mountains in the back, which is a GOOD thing, but I think that height changes only happen when in the proximity of water)
Image 2: Alpha
Image 3: Beta
Image 4: 1.3.1 (could tell because of gravel texture, instantaneous drop to the water's bed, and the crappy "beach")
You didn't even read my post, did you? The title was deliberately misleading to gain the attention of people with solid opinions regarding the terrain.
I was not expecting anyone to be so dense as to see the title, skip over the poll, post, GIANT BOLD LETTERING, pictures, and sensible replies just to get his jimmies all rustled over the title.
I made my thoughts before voting, then used them to decide which pictures belonged to which version. It's how you can tell which version is which. Sorry, I take long to edit my posts.
I used the lighting glitch to guess that the two pictures with giant unlit areas are the most recent ones. Numbers 1 and 3 are from 1.3.1
Between 2 and 4, I was less sure and I decided 2 was alpha because of the single grass color.
Again, the lighting, terrain color, mobs, textures, and clouds are all 1.3.1. All of the pictures were taken from within 1.3.1.
The actual terrain was generated in other versions.
Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-discussion/suggestions/2775557-guidelines-for-the-suggestions-forum