Perhaps it could use a key system. A player could craft a key to their own storage and then give that to trusted friends. You could steal another player's key, so it might be useful to have a way to reset the lock.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Mostly moved on. May check back a few times a year.
Perhaps it could use a key system. A player could craft a key to their own storage and then give that to trusted friends. You could steal another player's key, so it might be useful to have a way to reset the lock.
I think that that would be really cool, but I don't think that Mojang will go though the work to put that in, as that could get complicated.
That means you only need one.
*place chest
*place items
*put chest in inv
*place later and take items out
It teleports the items to a mystical place ready for retrieval.
I've been using it in creative for my coordinate books.
I think that Yogierin is saying, that the functionality you're describing, is a bug.
Which would make sense, because that functionality doesn't make any damn sense.
I don't see how requiring at least one chest to exist makes any more sense -- a room doesn't collapse if you remove the doors. Making it work that way wouldn't help anyone either, it would just require you to create one extra chest and leave it somewhere in the world.
I don't see how requiring at least one chest to exist makes any more sense -- a room doesn't collapse if you remove the doors. Making it work that way wouldn't help anyone either, it would just require you to create one extra chest and leave it somewhere in the world.
But then its networking functionality is pretty well overshadowed. Because you can just backpack with it.
Why didn't they just add a backpack chest?
I suppose most of this is rooted in the mod where the item came from...
I see it being very simple really. The main problems with these chests is that they offer a no risk system for rare item collecting. Place a chest in your base and carry one with you. "Oh look diamonds 5 million steps away from my spawn bed. Let's just place those in my ended chest along with my other valuable stuff and then just jump in some lava". Presto you find yourself home with all your stuff safe in the chest. Make another ender chest and do it all over.
-Solve this easily, only 2 chests per map. Now you can't just die a million miles away to quick travel with no loss. You would have to know where your chests are at all times. On servers the number of chests would be controlled by the admin.
Another problem I saw was the perfect inventory problem. Normally ingame I have 1 enchanted pick and 1 enchanted sword on me. Would I carry my silk touch or fortune pick just running around? No. I keep those at home safe until I need them. Now that we don't have to worry about losing a bunch of valuable items we could have a arsenal of opportunistic tools at our desire at any moment. Say I am caving and come across a spider dungion. This is one of those rare cases where I really would like my Bane of Arthropods sword. No I just plop down my ender chest and take it out. No need to worry about the possible loss of any other valuable and useful items I can have just the one I need at any moment.
This sort of takes away from the idea of a limited inventory. Some say "Relax dudes it's just one extra inventory". If that was the case fine but the problem is that it is a indestructible inventory.
Just in my opinion these changes would make it balanced:
Only 2 per world.
If you die with one of the chests in your inventory it is destroyed along with a random half of whatever you put in it. The other half will be waiting in the other chest.
Limit to 15 spots in the chest.
This just sounds like a more reasonable item to me.
I think that that would be really cool, but I don't think that Mojang will go though the work to put that in, as that could get complicated.
I suppose. The simplest thing to do I guess would be to put a GUI button to toggle between personal and server inventory. It would be nice to have a way to invite other players to your inventory, however, so you could have secure long-distance trading for projects.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Mostly moved on. May check back a few times a year.
No, I do not expect "all rainbows and flower petals" but I was thinking that it might be better if we as the community talked about a possible solution to the problem that some of us have with it. As compared to just yelling at each other.
I can see where you're coming from, but I think where you went wrong is here:
"What part about
"NOTE: Do NOT make this thread into an argument"
don't you people get."
Which, on the internet, is very easy to read as:
"Do not bother posting if you don't agree with me".
So that's probably why you're getting so much heat. It's just too good not to bite for the argumentative.
That said, I'm about to disagree with you, too.
The way I see it, if they're shared on SMP servers, they've been balanced enough. I know I'll never use one, but I'll definitely keep one in my house to see if anyone else uses one. Well, not really, I don't grief, but my point is that's probably the way most people are going to use them. Problem solves itself in multiplayer.
Where it IS kind of broken is in SSP, because it's basically a second (and protected) inventory. The thing is, I'm of the opinion that if someone wants to make their single player experience easier, more power to them. That's why cheat codes are fun and okay in Grand Theft Auto; you get to play your way and aren't ruining anyone else's enjoyment.
So, if I find them to be "broken" in my SSP playthroughs, I just won't use them.
(Though in all honesty I think they're great).
1.{I can see where you're coming from, but I think where you went wrong is here:
"What part about
"NOTE: Do NOT make this thread into an argument"
don't you people get."
Which, on the internet, is very easy to read as:
"Do not bother posting if you don't agree with me".
So that's probably why you're getting so much heat. It's just too good not to bite for the argumentative.}
2. {That said, I'm about to disagree with you, too.
The way I see it, if they're shared on SMP servers, they've been balanced enough. I know I'll never use one, but I'll definitely keep one in my house to see if anyone else uses one. Well, not really, I don't grief, but my point is that's probably the way most people are going to use them. Problem solves itself in multiplayer.}
3. {Where it IS kind of broken is in SSP, because it's basically a second (and protected) inventory. The thing is, I'm of the opinion that if someone wants to make their single player experience easier, more power to them. That's why cheat codes are fun and okay in Grand Theft Auto; you get to play your way and aren't ruining anyone else's enjoyment.
So, if I find them to be "broken" in my SSP playthroughs, I just won't use them.
(Though in all honesty I think they're great).}
1. Actually, I don't think that I have seen anyone who agrees with me post on this thread
2. I personally don't care that much about SMP, as I don't play it that much, so therefor, I think it is fine in SMP
3. The thing is, if Mojang is going to put something in the game, they should make sure it is balanced, otherwise they should have just left it as a mod, In relation to cheat codes: They are at least called cheats, not that it makes a big difference, but there is something about putting in a cheat code that makes you know that you are cheating, whereas the ender chest is just there for the taking. I also think that they are great, but I think that they could be improved.
what they should do before release it, is make the chest private by default, and add a bukkit command to share with everybody or an especific player, like normal chest do
3. The thing is, if Mojang is going to put something in the game, they should make sure it is balanced, otherwise they should have just left it as a mod,
First, there are no balance issues in a single player game where you have cheat codes anyway.
In relation to cheat codes: They are at least called cheats, not that it makes a big difference, but there is something about putting in a cheat code that makes you know that you are cheating, whereas the ender chest is just there for the taking. I also think that they are great, but I think that they could be improved.
You mean improved so that the people who use them the way they were intended are screwed out of an already balanced item so that you can feel better about using it?
1. Actually, I don't think that I have seen anyone who agrees with me post on this thread
2. I personally don't care that much about SMP, as I don't play it that much, so therefor, I think it is fine in SMP
3. The thing is, if Mojang is going to put something in the game, they should make sure it is balanced, otherwise they should have just left it as a mod, In relation to cheat codes: They are at least called cheats, not that it makes a big difference, but there is something about putting in a cheat code that makes you know that you are cheating, whereas the ender chest is just there for the taking. I also think that they are great, but I think that they could be improved.
Addressing them chronlogically (I like lists, too!):
1) That probably say something about the content of your argument.
And regardless, that's kind of my point. I'm saying that you're approaching this thread as if people are only allowed to respond if they agree with your position. When you say things like "What part of no arguing don't you understand' or "So far no one has agreed with me anyway", the message you're sending is that you made this thread to be agreed with an ignore conflicting ideas.
Really, shouldn't the goal be to listen to and consider all opposing viewpoints? If you're really correct, you should be able to counter or compensate for opposing positions, that's how you know your idea is really strong to begin with.
2) I can relate. As it is, I don't really like SMP that much, either, as I'd rather play with friends than on a server owned by someone else calling all of the shots / making stupid rules /living somewhere inconvenient where my latency is garbage.
That said, your argument doesn't work in reverse; it's all well and good to say "well nevermind SMP, I don't really care about it", but everyone else could say exactly the same thing about your view of enderchests in SSP.
That would still be wrong of them, and a terribly low-quality argument, but the point is that it's essentially the same thing and results in neither side getting anywhere.
3) I will concede this point.
Things should be balanced carefully, even in SSP. You've got me there. Otherwise it isn't fun.
The cheat thing is largely an issue of semantics though; the difference lies not in the name but the implementation. Contra doesn't pop up with a tutorial that says "call up up down down left right left right B A Start for a good time", so it isn't really a feature. The chest is a feature. My point was not that all of SSP should be unbalanced with cheat codes, but that "fun" is subjective and in a solo environment, it doesn't hurt you if your neighbor has game breaking equipment. I'm sure the creepers don't like it, but since they aren't players no one is really suffering. Well, depending on how much you watched Reboot as a child, maybe it is.
But no, you're right there. If it doesn't feel right in the game, it's in mod territory.
I personally don't think it's so bad, but I haven't had it around long enough to be any sort of authority. So, meh.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Superpop is so underground, he lives with a Diglett!
3) I will concede this point.
Things should be balanced carefully, even in SSP. You've got me there. Otherwise it isn't fun.
I ask again, what balance is there to be had in a game where all your challenges are self-imposed? I could build a 2x1x1 hole and say that I won and you can't dispute that.
I ask again, what balance is there to be had in a game where all your challenges are self-imposed? I could build a 2x1x1 hole and say that I won and you can't dispute that.
I kind of feel like you didn't read the rest of my post, since we're arguing for the same position (pro enderchests), but okay.
In response the bit about self-imposed challenges, you are totally correct. Similarly you could set a goal for yourself to collect 1 diamond, and say you beat everyone at everything forever when you succeed.
The balance part comes in as an effort from the developer to frame your self-imposed challenges with rules and smaller challenges. Even in a totally sandbox game like Minecraft, those have to be in place as a sort of groundwork. For example, fall too far and you die, creepers blow you up, you can't stay under water forever or you drown.
So, let's go back to diamonds as an example. You can set any number of diamonds as a goal for yourself if that's what you want, but it doesn't suit the game's purpose to make every diamond block drop 50 diamonds when mined. Yes, technically the number is arbitrary because I can say one diamond was my goal and win instantly anyway, but that doesn't mean it should be made easy for you.
That said, again, I remind you that we actually seem to agree that the chests are fine as is.
Your challenge just stirs my desire to play devil's advocate.
People said the same thing about potions, beds, enchanting, villagers, and wolves.
Very true, but keep in mind I'm using "feel" to mean "feel fair", not "atmospheric, this doesn't belong in the cannon world of minecraft feel".
So like, is this fun versus I know that feel bro.
I should have clarified. <3
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Superpop is so underground, he lives with a Diglett!
The balance part comes in as an effort from the developer to frame your self-imposed challenges with rules and smaller challenges. Even in a totally sandbox game like Minecraft, those have to be in place as a sort of groundwork. For example, fall too far and you die, creepers blow you up, you can't stay under water forever or you drown.
However nothing like that happens in Creative Mode. Survival mode is just a mode that sets those limitations on you.
So, let's go back to diamonds as an example. You can set any number of diamonds as a goal for yourself if that's what you want, but it doesn't suit the game's purpose to make every diamond block drop 50 diamonds when mined.
That's because getting one diamond per block has already been established. If always dropped 50 diamonds or 3 diamonds or 100 diamonds, we would be having a different discussion altogether.
Yes, technically the number is arbitrary because I can say one diamond was my goal and win instantly anyway, but that doesn't mean it should be made easy for you.
Mostly moved on. May check back a few times a year.
I think that that would be really cool, but I don't think that Mojang will go though the work to put that in, as that could get complicated.
BOOM~! Source?
*place chest
*place items
*put chest in inv
*place later and take items out
It teleports the items to a mystical place ready for retrieval.
I've been using it in creative for my coordinate books.
I think that Yogierin is saying, that the functionality you're describing, is a bug.
Which would make sense, because that functionality doesn't make any damn sense.
But then its networking functionality is pretty well overshadowed. Because you can just backpack with it.
Why didn't they just add a backpack chest?
I suppose most of this is rooted in the mod where the item came from...
I see it being very simple really. The main problems with these chests is that they offer a no risk system for rare item collecting. Place a chest in your base and carry one with you. "Oh look diamonds 5 million steps away from my spawn bed. Let's just place those in my ended chest along with my other valuable stuff and then just jump in some lava". Presto you find yourself home with all your stuff safe in the chest. Make another ender chest and do it all over.
-Solve this easily, only 2 chests per map. Now you can't just die a million miles away to quick travel with no loss. You would have to know where your chests are at all times. On servers the number of chests would be controlled by the admin.
Another problem I saw was the perfect inventory problem. Normally ingame I have 1 enchanted pick and 1 enchanted sword on me. Would I carry my silk touch or fortune pick just running around? No. I keep those at home safe until I need them. Now that we don't have to worry about losing a bunch of valuable items we could have a arsenal of opportunistic tools at our desire at any moment. Say I am caving and come across a spider dungion. This is one of those rare cases where I really would like my Bane of Arthropods sword. No I just plop down my ender chest and take it out. No need to worry about the possible loss of any other valuable and useful items I can have just the one I need at any moment.
This sort of takes away from the idea of a limited inventory. Some say "Relax dudes it's just one extra inventory". If that was the case fine but the problem is that it is a indestructible inventory.
Just in my opinion these changes would make it balanced:
Only 2 per world.
If you die with one of the chests in your inventory it is destroyed along with a random half of whatever you put in it. The other half will be waiting in the other chest.
Limit to 15 spots in the chest.
This just sounds like a more reasonable item to me.
Dylan
Mostly moved on. May check back a few times a year.
I can see where you're coming from, but I think where you went wrong is here:
"What part about
"NOTE: Do NOT make this thread into an argument"
don't you people get."
Which, on the internet, is very easy to read as:
"Do not bother posting if you don't agree with me".
So that's probably why you're getting so much heat. It's just too good not to bite for the argumentative.
That said, I'm about to disagree with you, too.
The way I see it, if they're shared on SMP servers, they've been balanced enough. I know I'll never use one, but I'll definitely keep one in my house to see if anyone else uses one. Well, not really, I don't grief, but my point is that's probably the way most people are going to use them. Problem solves itself in multiplayer.
Where it IS kind of broken is in SSP, because it's basically a second (and protected) inventory. The thing is, I'm of the opinion that if someone wants to make their single player experience easier, more power to them. That's why cheat codes are fun and okay in Grand Theft Auto; you get to play your way and aren't ruining anyone else's enjoyment.
So, if I find them to be "broken" in my SSP playthroughs, I just won't use them.
(Though in all honesty I think they're great).
Superpop is so underground, he lives with a Diglett!
Single player is fine! (I use as a way to transport my ores to my house!)
some tweaks could be like a lockette sort of whitelist
1. Actually, I don't think that I have seen anyone who agrees with me post on this thread
2. I personally don't care that much about SMP, as I don't play it that much, so therefor, I think it is fine in SMP
3. The thing is, if Mojang is going to put something in the game, they should make sure it is balanced, otherwise they should have just left it as a mod, In relation to cheat codes: They are at least called cheats, not that it makes a big difference, but there is something about putting in a cheat code that makes you know that you are cheating, whereas the ender chest is just there for the taking. I also think that they are great, but I think that they could be improved.
There's still two sides and that doesn't change it from being a debate.
First, there are no balance issues in a single player game where you have cheat codes anyway.
You mean improved so that the people who use them the way they were intended are screwed out of an already balanced item so that you can feel better about using it?
Addressing them chronlogically (I like lists, too!):
1) That probably say something about the content of your argument.
And regardless, that's kind of my point. I'm saying that you're approaching this thread as if people are only allowed to respond if they agree with your position. When you say things like "What part of no arguing don't you understand' or "So far no one has agreed with me anyway", the message you're sending is that you made this thread to be agreed with an ignore conflicting ideas.
Really, shouldn't the goal be to listen to and consider all opposing viewpoints? If you're really correct, you should be able to counter or compensate for opposing positions, that's how you know your idea is really strong to begin with.
2) I can relate. As it is, I don't really like SMP that much, either, as I'd rather play with friends than on a server owned by someone else calling all of the shots / making stupid rules /living somewhere inconvenient where my latency is garbage.
That said, your argument doesn't work in reverse; it's all well and good to say "well nevermind SMP, I don't really care about it", but everyone else could say exactly the same thing about your view of enderchests in SSP.
That would still be wrong of them, and a terribly low-quality argument, but the point is that it's essentially the same thing and results in neither side getting anywhere.
3) I will concede this point.
Things should be balanced carefully, even in SSP. You've got me there. Otherwise it isn't fun.
The cheat thing is largely an issue of semantics though; the difference lies not in the name but the implementation. Contra doesn't pop up with a tutorial that says "call up up down down left right left right B A Start for a good time", so it isn't really a feature. The chest is a feature. My point was not that all of SSP should be unbalanced with cheat codes, but that "fun" is subjective and in a solo environment, it doesn't hurt you if your neighbor has game breaking equipment. I'm sure the creepers don't like it, but since they aren't players no one is really suffering. Well, depending on how much you watched Reboot as a child, maybe it is.
But no, you're right there. If it doesn't feel right in the game, it's in mod territory.
I personally don't think it's so bad, but I haven't had it around long enough to be any sort of authority. So, meh.
Superpop is so underground, he lives with a Diglett!
I ask again, what balance is there to be had in a game where all your challenges are self-imposed? I could build a 2x1x1 hole and say that I won and you can't dispute that.
People said the same thing about potions, beds, enchanting, villagers, and wolves.
I kind of feel like you didn't read the rest of my post, since we're arguing for the same position (pro enderchests), but okay.
In response the bit about self-imposed challenges, you are totally correct. Similarly you could set a goal for yourself to collect 1 diamond, and say you beat everyone at everything forever when you succeed.
The balance part comes in as an effort from the developer to frame your self-imposed challenges with rules and smaller challenges. Even in a totally sandbox game like Minecraft, those have to be in place as a sort of groundwork. For example, fall too far and you die, creepers blow you up, you can't stay under water forever or you drown.
So, let's go back to diamonds as an example. You can set any number of diamonds as a goal for yourself if that's what you want, but it doesn't suit the game's purpose to make every diamond block drop 50 diamonds when mined. Yes, technically the number is arbitrary because I can say one diamond was my goal and win instantly anyway, but that doesn't mean it should be made easy for you.
That said, again, I remind you that we actually seem to agree that the chests are fine as is.
Your challenge just stirs my desire to play devil's advocate.
Oh, this bit:
Very true, but keep in mind I'm using "feel" to mean "feel fair", not "atmospheric, this doesn't belong in the cannon world of minecraft feel".
So like, is this fun versus I know that feel bro.
I should have clarified. <3
Superpop is so underground, he lives with a Diglett!
I didn't have anything to say to that bit.
However nothing like that happens in Creative Mode. Survival mode is just a mode that sets those limitations on you.
That's because getting one diamond per block has already been established. If always dropped 50 diamonds or 3 diamonds or 100 diamonds, we would be having a different discussion altogether.
Peaceful mode.