I personally don't think that the enderman farms are over powered because:
It's just like a slow exp farm (skeleton or zombie) but faster.
Enderman farms take up alot of materials.
So, not at all if you do it right? Sounds like you invalidated your entire argument.
In this particular instance, he only needs one argument: it's what the server pop wants. That invalidates anything else you may bring to the table, no matter how well-reasoned. My suggestion would be to work up some numbers on a high quality skele / zombie farm, particularly turnover time 0-30, and then compare that to a few differing ender farms, all the way up to the deluxe automated high spawn rate one-punch model. Show this to the other players, and see if you can't get some converts. Turn it around from, "I want this, even though nobody else does, and here's all my reasons," to, "I want this, nobody cares, and there's no good reason not to."
Before he locked the thread there was a 50 50 poll I they where OP so I might have changed some of there minds.
Before he locked the thread there was a 50 50 poll I they where OP so I might have changed some of there minds.
Sounds like you're making progress. Keep fighting the good fight (without turning into an obnoxious whiny spammer, mind you), and point 'em at this thread if they need to see the logic argued. Just remember that your core argument is strong enough to stand on its own merit: an ender farm does nothing that a sufficiently complex skele / zombie farm won't do.
I don't think Enderman farms are overpowered at all, all things considered. If they were something you could do in the midgame of a world (the point where you're just reaching the Nether/finding Diamonds), then I would say that it'd be completely broken, but since it's an endgame structure (you've beaten the Ender Dragon, but perhaps haven't fully done everything you can in your world yet), it's balanced.
It's balanced by how useful it is - because you've defeated the Ender Dragon, have mined diamonds, have been to the Nether, and have experienced so much, the experience point potential isn't making things too easy, but acts more as a convenience. Enderman farms might be better-tuned if they were a postgame structure (as in, you've defeated the Wither, you have several automated farms, and you have a well-protected, self-sustained base), but I don't think their current strength level is too strong - they're powerful, but not overly so.
I think that they are overpowered by i've never done one.
Well then you shouldn't be judging it. This is what happens at the voting booth. People see someone's name "hey I know that name! I'll vote or him!" They do that without knowing anything about that person. If you don't have any idea what you are voting for, stay home.
So, from what I've read it looks like the argument here is all farms v. all but enderman farms? I can reach level 30 in maybe 45 minutes of hunting at night in iron gear. XP/Spawner farms at all are overpowered. Sure they take lots of effort sometimes, but that doesn't mean suddenly you should have access to infinite XP. Soon enough I'm going to be running a server, and farms shall not be allowed. Go hunt, jeez.
Oh yeah, and as of recently, mining, smelting, and fishing also give XP, so do whatever floats your boat, even if that's water.
that doesn't mean suddenly you should have access to infinite XP.
Everyone has access to infinite XP without enemy mob farms, via either cobblestone generators and cooking stone, or via animal breeding (and potentially cooking byproducts). The only differences between any forms of XP generation are risk (for which there are a good dozen no-risk methods), rate of XP gain, and yielded products.
So, from what I've read it looks like the argument here is all farms v. all but enderman farms? I can reach level 30 in maybe 45 minutes of hunting at night in iron gear. XP/Spawner farms at all are overpowered. Sure they take lots of effort sometimes, but that doesn't mean suddenly you should have access to infinite XP. Soon enough I'm going to be running a server, and farms shall not be allowed. Go hunt, jeez.
Oh yeah, and as of recently, mining, smelting, and fishing also give XP, so do whatever floats your boat, even if that's water.
You really want to spend 45 minutes trying to get to level 30 EVERY TIME? Think about the times you have gotten another eff. 3 pick! When I get one I'm mad because its really the worst thing you could get on a pickaxe with a level 30 enchant. Think about wanting fortune 3 on a pick then you go out and for 45 minutes of your life hunt for XP at night. And you get a stupid efficiency 3 pick. Now you have to waste ANOTHER 45 minutes trying to get to level 30! It's a 13.1 percent chance to get fortune 3 on a pick that means it could take more than 7 pick enchants to get it. If you spent 45 minutes each time you got to level 30 to enchant a diamond pickaxe and it took 7 picks to get the fortune you wanted it would take 5 hours and 15 minutes. If you do that than you have zero life. I bet no one will join your server if you make them do that.
Personally, I think Enderman farms are overpowered, but I don't want anything to prevent them. What can Mojang do anyway to do so?
The variable HP when mobs spawn will stop a lot of exp farms. As well as the increased difficulty of staying in an area for a length of time. It won't break them or anything it will just make em a little harder to do.
It's just like a slow exp farm (skeleton or zombie) but faster.
Enderman farms take up alot of materials.
Before he locked the thread there was a 50 50 poll I they where OP so I might have changed some of there minds.
Sounds like you're making progress. Keep fighting the good fight (without turning into an obnoxious whiny spammer, mind you), and point 'em at this thread if they need to see the logic argued. Just remember that your core argument is strong enough to stand on its own merit: an ender farm does nothing that a sufficiently complex skele / zombie farm won't do.
It's balanced by how useful it is - because you've defeated the Ender Dragon, have mined diamonds, have been to the Nether, and have experienced so much, the experience point potential isn't making things too easy, but acts more as a convenience. Enderman farms might be better-tuned if they were a postgame structure (as in, you've defeated the Wither, you have several automated farms, and you have a well-protected, self-sustained base), but I don't think their current strength level is too strong - they're powerful, but not overly so.
So, no.
Well then you shouldn't be judging it. This is what happens at the voting booth. People see someone's name "hey I know that name! I'll vote or him!" They do that without knowing anything about that person. If you don't have any idea what you are voting for, stay home.
Oh yeah, and as of recently, mining, smelting, and fishing also give XP, so do whatever floats your boat, even if that's water.
Everyone has access to infinite XP without enemy mob farms, via either cobblestone generators and cooking stone, or via animal breeding (and potentially cooking byproducts). The only differences between any forms of XP generation are risk (for which there are a good dozen no-risk methods), rate of XP gain, and yielded products.
You really want to spend 45 minutes trying to get to level 30 EVERY TIME? Think about the times you have gotten another eff. 3 pick! When I get one I'm mad because its really the worst thing you could get on a pickaxe with a level 30 enchant. Think about wanting fortune 3 on a pick then you go out and for 45 minutes of your life hunt for XP at night. And you get a stupid efficiency 3 pick. Now you have to waste ANOTHER 45 minutes trying to get to level 30! It's a 13.1 percent chance to get fortune 3 on a pick that means it could take more than 7 pick enchants to get it. If you spent 45 minutes each time you got to level 30 to enchant a diamond pickaxe and it took 7 picks to get the fortune you wanted it would take 5 hours and 15 minutes. If you do that than you have zero life. I bet no one will join your server if you make them do that.
Reduce xp given from endermen in the end?
Only from enderman in the end? But thats there home! Thats where their the strongest!
The variable HP when mobs spawn will stop a lot of exp farms. As well as the increased difficulty of staying in an area for a length of time. It won't break them or anything it will just make em a little harder to do.
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