You guys are really speaking out your ass about some of this stuff. I don't even know where to begin with your giant post on page 2, UberFubarius. There's so many things that are naive at best and flat out wrong at worst.
I'm going to assume you've never actually written any serious graphics applications in the past. Because if you had, you'd never have passed off Cubeland's lighting system in favor of what Notch did in terms of difficulty, because I can tell you right now that the system Notch has in place isn't really difficult at all. In fact, compared to SSAO and what appears to be VSM shadow maps, the per-tile distance algorithm Notch is using right now is child's play. Just because the GPU gets to front the majority of the calculations doesn't mean it's "easy". Do you really think that you can just instruct the graphics card to "draw shadows"? A lot of work goes into developing that kind of lighting. The "difficulty" in Notch's implementation is the fact that he stores the lighting value for each tile and needs to rebuild his vertex buffers for that chunk every time a light is added. That's a limitation in platform, since he's forced to use OpenGL 1.1, where as using shaders would alleviate some of the hard-coded hardships he's forced to face.
I'm kind of puzzled about this portion:
1. Lighting triggered events - Now, Cubelands have better lighting/shadow system, and minecraft technically can do those too, the difficulty is that minecraft NEEDS to know what the brightness values are in order to spawn mobs (which cubelands doesn't need to know). In short, Cubeland can order the graphics card to draw light/shadow for them and that is that. Minecraft NEEDS to know what block is at what brightness (which, graphics card generally don't tell you).
What...? First off, Minecraft cannot duplicate the Cubelands lighting system. It's currently out of Notch's reach. The Cubeland team can't just "order" the graphics card to draw lighting and "that's that". Second, there's no difficulty in what you're proposing Minecraft needs to do. Notch stores the raw voxel information in memory. He can perform a quick lookup to find tiles under a certain brightness. It's not hard. How you can suggest otherwise tells me that you really don't understand what you're talking about. I assure you that using a lighting system similar to that of Cubeland, it is trivial to find out how bright or dark it is in any given area.
2. Dynamic lighting - Cubeland, as it appears, only have a single light source (the sky), which makes lighting calculation easy. And defaults to full-bright in door. Minecraft needs to handle dynamic lighting. This alone will chew up a lot of processing resources.
Again, you're speaking out your ass, here. All lighting in Minecraft is pre-calculated, a sort of editable light map. Every time you destroy a tile, add a tile, or add/remove a light source, the lighting for the chunk is rebuilt. This isn't hard. I can't stress this enough. This is. not. hard.
I have played it, it is closer to roblox, it doesn't even have crafting! just because it is a game that has blocks doesn't mean it is anything like minecraft.
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*salutes* I am Dave! Yognaut! (If you know what this means, then copy it into your sig)
You guys are really speaking out your ass about some of this stuff. I don't even know where to begin with your giant post on page 2, UberFubarius. There's so many things that are naive at best and flat out wrong at worst.
I'm going to assume you've never actually written any serious graphics applications in the past.
Didn't written graphics applications in the past, did work with graphics accelerator (architecture) side.
When I say easy/hard, I'm not referring to how hard it is to program it, I'm referring to the CPU-load (proportional) it needs.
Im actually thinking of making a Minecraft clone. It would be called "Dungeon Diggers". The only above ground part would be a small island, and you cant go far into the ocean or you will drown, and you cant dig into the ocean from below. I already have a basic concept going. Can someone also tell me what notch is using to make minecraft? Because Im learning how to use Python. And if anyones interested in helping, pm me.
And like the baseless fabric of this vision, the cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, the solemn temples, the giant Screen itself, all of which we inherit shall dissolve. And, like an insubstantial pageant faded, leave not a byte behind.
Notch has the advantage when it comes to portability however. No other game will be able to target as many systems as Notch can.
Not entirely true. Notch can only support the systems that both support Java and the game development library (LWJGL). There are a number of systems out there that could handle this game were it written in a combination of C++, SDL, and OpenGL.
Your statement would be true if you had stated he could support all the major popular systems on commonly found hardware. Windows, Mac, and Linux (running on x86/x64).
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Quote from Rotten194 »
Playing games with integrated graphics is like going on the Autobahn in a tricycle.
This topic comes up every week, please cut it out.
No, Minecraft is not an original idea, Notch took the idea from Infiniminer. No, these other creators aren't breaking the law, no Notch won't sue them.
I'm going to assume you've never actually written any serious graphics applications in the past. Because if you had, you'd never have passed off Cubeland's lighting system in favor of what Notch did in terms of difficulty, because I can tell you right now that the system Notch has in place isn't really difficult at all. In fact, compared to SSAO and what appears to be VSM shadow maps, the per-tile distance algorithm Notch is using right now is child's play. Just because the GPU gets to front the majority of the calculations doesn't mean it's "easy". Do you really think that you can just instruct the graphics card to "draw shadows"? A lot of work goes into developing that kind of lighting. The "difficulty" in Notch's implementation is the fact that he stores the lighting value for each tile and needs to rebuild his vertex buffers for that chunk every time a light is added. That's a limitation in platform, since he's forced to use OpenGL 1.1, where as using shaders would alleviate some of the hard-coded hardships he's forced to face.
I'm kind of puzzled about this portion:
1. Lighting triggered events - Now, Cubelands have better lighting/shadow system, and minecraft technically can do those too, the difficulty is that minecraft NEEDS to know what the brightness values are in order to spawn mobs (which cubelands doesn't need to know). In short, Cubeland can order the graphics card to draw light/shadow for them and that is that. Minecraft NEEDS to know what block is at what brightness (which, graphics card generally don't tell you).
What...? First off, Minecraft cannot duplicate the Cubelands lighting system. It's currently out of Notch's reach. The Cubeland team can't just "order" the graphics card to draw lighting and "that's that". Second, there's no difficulty in what you're proposing Minecraft needs to do. Notch stores the raw voxel information in memory. He can perform a quick lookup to find tiles under a certain brightness. It's not hard. How you can suggest otherwise tells me that you really don't understand what you're talking about. I assure you that using a lighting system similar to that of Cubeland, it is trivial to find out how bright or dark it is in any given area.
2. Dynamic lighting - Cubeland, as it appears, only have a single light source (the sky), which makes lighting calculation easy. And defaults to full-bright in door. Minecraft needs to handle dynamic lighting. This alone will chew up a lot of processing resources.
Again, you're speaking out your ass, here. All lighting in Minecraft is pre-calculated, a sort of editable light map. Every time you destroy a tile, add a tile, or add/remove a light source, the lighting for the chunk is rebuilt. This isn't hard. I can't stress this enough. This is. not. hard.
Didn't written graphics applications in the past, did work with graphics accelerator (architecture) side.
When I say easy/hard, I'm not referring to how hard it is to program it, I'm referring to the CPU-load (proportional) it needs.
"PERMABANS
Posting or linking to anything relating to the pirating, or copying, of any software game title, especially Minecraft."
Thanks, voicelessbard for the great avatar and sig! (search him in the MC forums)
We're talking about another game that have some similarity to Minecraft (arguably very similar).
I think he's using Java.
You should name it CraftCraft.
http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=51308
Honestly, I think that is a stupid name.
That is pretty cool.
I want to keep the work "Craft" out of the title.
MineConstruct
MineAssemble
MineTinker
MineBuild
MinePutTogether
MineManufacture
...
I doubt China was being sincere when they imitate Apple (among other companies).
Not entirely true. Notch can only support the systems that both support Java and the game development library (LWJGL). There are a number of systems out there that could handle this game were it written in a combination of C++, SDL, and OpenGL.
Your statement would be true if you had stated he could support all the major popular systems on commonly found hardware. Windows, Mac, and Linux (running on x86/x64).
No, Minecraft is not an original idea, Notch took the idea from Infiniminer. No, these other creators aren't breaking the law, no Notch won't sue them.
Cut it out.