*Fangirl mode*
OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG!!!!!!
YES!!! All the mods(and then a few) that i use all the time in one neat little package! and the ability to add mods on top to boot(there are one or two here and there that i use as well).
Well, i know i am going to be keeping a super close eye on this thread... when im not playing minecraft that is.
Sorry if i sound like a Noob or a Technic Pack lover but will the pack have a launcher like the Technic pack, and have an amount of ram you want on your Mine Craft at one time, because I have a very slow regular Mine Craft but i can change the amount of GB i use with the Technic launcher and then I can actually play and not lag like a boss unless I'm on tiny render distance.
Sorry if i sound like a Noob or a Technic Pack lover but will the pack have a launcher like the Technic pack, and have an amount of ram you want on your Mine Craft at one time, because I have a very slow regular Mine Craft but i can change the amount of GB i use with the Technic launcher and then I can actually play and not lag like a boss unless I'm on tiny render distance.
Just for the purposes of clarification with regards to the inclusion of various mods and updates. My intention is to release the initial pack once it has enough mods for it to be viable to actually release it as a mod pack. In other words. if 3-4 of the mods are lagging behind for whatever reason. I can and will still release the pack and add further mods in later.
As to updates, my intention is to make this pack the most up to date pack possible. In other words expect regular updates oh and of course it will have an auto update feature.
so i guess it will, it looks way more professional, and lets the user configure things more easily, instead of a batch file for example
EDIT: after reading my own post: i`m certain it will be a launcher
So over the last few days and weeks there has been a lot of comments made about mod packs, the pack we are producing and the obvious comparison to technic and tekkit. My own personal feelings are reasonably public as to those packs. However I am endlessly reading statements from players on both sides which contain inaccurate statements. This post is mainly going to be focused on clearing up some of those innaccuracies. So if anyone reads stuff in the future from people who dont really have a clue whats going on, maybe you can point them towards this.
Before I start, I would like to make absolutely clear that I do not speak for any mod maker in this. These are my own personal observations and parts of them may be inaccurate. Feel free to correct me IF you can provide a substantive source for your correction.
OK lets start with the first most obvious question. Is technic and tekkit legal.
I am not a legal expert by any means and I have had different people tell me different things. However I have always sought to find out for myself what the truth is. In this regard, it boils down to something called derivative copyright. I have tried looking up information on this and the only real semi reliable posting I have found is on the unreal wiki
Whether the copyright is valid seems to be decided on whether or not Mojang implicitly gives permissions for modder to actually mod minecraft. The Minecraft terms and conditions are slightly shaky on this, but overall it appears yes it does. As referenced under the what you can do rule of the terms and conditions
So unless someone can show me otherwise, I have to believe that modders hold a derivative copywrite on their work and that includes
the exclusive right to reproduction,
the exclusive right to derivative works,
the exclusive right to distribution and
the exclusive right to public performance and display.
In the case of Mod Packs, the important part obviously is the exclusive right to distribution.
So now we have this information, are technic and tekkit legal. Well again I havent just taken other peoples words for this. I have literally gone through every single mod in the mod pack and in the cases where general permissions for inclusion in mod packs isnt given in the respective threads, I have approached the actual mod authors for their views. So the answer to the question is No they do not have a full set of permissions, however they are REALLY close to it. From the best of what I can gather, they are at most missing permissions for 3 maybe 4 mods. All the other mods in the pack either give general consents to all packs or the author doesnt care enough about technic or tekkit to say yes or no.
So what is the big huge problem. Well from my own personal point of view the legalities aside its down to pure respect. I want to very quickly reference something here.
This isnt hearsay or anything like that, these are Kakermix's own words. This is one mod maker very clearly stating in public that technic does not have consent to use the mod and yet they continue to do so. I see no possible valid excuse for this. Whether or not it is legal, it is damn sure disrespectful to the creator. The following line from post number 65 is very informative
'I did not get permission from anyone and I didn't even bother asking. The Minecraft modding community is terrible and the egos some of the modders themselves have is incredibly terrible. I simply made this pack because I love these mods and want other people to experience them as well with as little work on their part as possible.'
And yet just 3 posts earlier we see a post that contains the line
'Nobody knows that we are friends with Eloraam, or that Ablaka was the first to give us permission, or that Xenophobe has always been thankful for us, or that Technic and the Yogscast is directly responsible for Thaumcraft being created.'
They are right in one thing nobody does know any of the information in that sentence, because quite frankly (and yes I have spoken directly to the Mod Authors) that sentence belongs in the Fiction Section of the local library.
Now having said all this, there are a few other things that I believe need to be made clear. Technic and Tekkit are really good ideas, there was a time a while back Where some of the modders tried to talk to the guys behind technicpack to resolve the issues. Attempts were made and they got nowhere. At the time this was no huge surprise because they still had one major hurdle to get over and that was the policies of Risugami with regards to the re-distribution of ModLoader. I have no idea if Technic had consent. However I can tell you that the response that we were given is that it is or was Risu's policy that you could re-distribute ModLoader as long as you did not ask permission to re-distribute it. As soon as you asked for permission, those implied permissions were revoked (unless you happened to catch Risu on a good day. I do know a couple of people who were given permission.) This was fine but this information wasnt conveyed anywhere. This meant that pretty much all mod packs that used launchers were breaking at the very least the minecraft forum rules which state that you have to have clear written permissions to promote your pack on the minecraft forums.
Getting back to the point. Technic and Tekkit as a pack are good idea's they are just implemented by people who generally dont care about the makers of the mods. They hide behind the line of 'We dont advertise permissions because it is pointless and if you dont believe us then well whatever.' This however does not apply to the users of the Techniclauncher. At the end of the day they just want the same thing as everyone else in this thread. An easy way to play Minecraft with mods without having to mess around. Further, when they play on servers, they want to be able to just give their friends a link say run this and let go screw around on a server. Thats what technic and tekkit provide and until now they have never really had anything serious in the way of competition. But we are not out to Get technic or have them burn in the fires of hell. We are just here to provide an alternative. Primarily I built a mod pack so people could easily play my maps. Now the mod pack is there so people can just enjoy playing minecraft the way I like to play it.
Before I finish off there is one other important point I would like to make here. Maybe correcting the biggest misconception there is with regards to the users of Technic and Tekkit. and that is adfly links. The reason mod makers dont want to see their mods in technic and tekkit is not because of some obscure belief that they want to protect and preserve the incomes they derive from these links. Whilst those incomes are helpful to some, it is not the be all and end all. However I can tell everyone this which should hopefully prove this point. I have spoken to a lot of the mod makers that are included in the FTB pack. Not just over the last week, but over the last several months. In that entire time with only one exception, every modmaker has not only granted me permission to use the mods in the mod pack but a lot of them have also been completely supportive in actually helping to add features needed.
My assumption is that if what the technic people say has been true all along, then they would be in full support of this mod pack and what we are trying to achieve. After all we all want the same thing, we are just going about it in different ways.
Anyways this is already FAR to long. However I hope it is slightly informative to at least a few people.
I'm sorry for my flame-baiting, inflammatory posts earlier, slowpoke. Really.
So, you do have Azanor's permission for TC3, then? He didn't post on the permissions thread, but if you have approached him personally, that's awesome.
So, um, are all the mod makers pretty good friends with each other and you?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
70% of people have signatures that try and boost their superiority complexes. Post this if you're a hypocrite.
So, you do have Azanor's permission for TC3, then? He didn't post on the permissions thread, but if you have approached him personally, that's awesome.
So, um, are all the mod makers pretty good friends with each other and you?
We are friends with the makers of most of the mods in the pack. They very few authors we don't know have public licenses that all distribution by anyone. As for TC3, rest assured we will have proper permissions posted by the time we include it, however it's a ways off yet.
Slowpoke. I know you probably wont read this but here i go. I respect most of your opinions on the Technic/ Tekkit pack. I have spent numerous hours watching hours and hours of DW20 and all of you guys and let me say i am a huge fan.I also have been lurking the Technic forums so i have heard both sides of the conversation. I am not a Let's Player, a modder or a donator(I am just a student). I am just a regular minecrafter who has seen both sides of the story. I have played Minecraft both Dire's way and the Technic way and I have watch let's plays of both.I have followed the very early developmental of all these mods. I personally love all the work that you and all the other mod makers do. I personally believe that what you are doing with this pack will help the modding community and the Minecraft community as a whole.
I myself am not a modder. I am just a regular minecrafter and the community as a whole has been shaken by this subject. I wish that the community could be a peace and this mod pack shows that there is light at the end of the tunnel. You may not understand what this will mean. To stop the bickering. To make an end to so much controversy. You maybe on to something here. The pack will never end all the fuel but hopefully. You can help the fire raging inside of the beast and let the modding community be at rest. Thank you for reading. I hope you take this into consideration.
While I will be installing all the mods manually for my SP world, I am really looking forward to this modpack. I can't wait to see how this will affect the modding community. This pack includes practically every mod I use, and finding servers that include most of the mods I want is very difficult if not impossible.
I've spoken to Azanor and I can confirm that TC3 is not a typo, Azanor is naming ArcanaCraft as ThaumCraft 3 when it is released.
Technically there is no SSP any more. Everything is SMP so everything should work with minecraft server.
Unless you're talking Bukkit, which does need a little work to modify the SMP version of a mod to work in the Bukkit environment.
OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG!!!!!!
YES!!! All the mods(and then a few) that i use all the time in one neat little package! and the ability to add mods on top to boot(there are one or two here and there that i use as well).
Well, i know i am going to be keeping a super close eye on this thread... when im not playing minecraft that is.
So every time someone gets the Enderdragon egg, the "Endermen" get angry and destroy their world with lag?
Why not?
so i guess it will, it looks way more professional, and lets the user configure things more easily, instead of a batch file for example
EDIT: after reading my own post: i`m certain it will be a launcher
Thank I appeciate the answer
Before I start, I would like to make absolutely clear that I do not speak for any mod maker in this. These are my own personal observations and parts of them may be inaccurate. Feel free to correct me IF you can provide a substantive source for your correction.
OK lets start with the first most obvious question. Is technic and tekkit legal.
I am not a legal expert by any means and I have had different people tell me different things. However I have always sought to find out for myself what the truth is. In this regard, it boils down to something called derivative copyright. I have tried looking up information on this and the only real semi reliable posting I have found is on the unreal wiki
http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/Legacy:Mod_Copyright
Whether the copyright is valid seems to be decided on whether or not Mojang implicitly gives permissions for modder to actually mod minecraft. The Minecraft terms and conditions are slightly shaky on this, but overall it appears yes it does. As referenced under the what you can do rule of the terms and conditions
http://www.minecraft.net/terms
So unless someone can show me otherwise, I have to believe that modders hold a derivative copywrite on their work and that includes
the exclusive right to reproduction,
the exclusive right to derivative works,
the exclusive right to distribution and
the exclusive right to public performance and display.
In the case of Mod Packs, the important part obviously is the exclusive right to distribution.
So now we have this information, are technic and tekkit legal. Well again I havent just taken other peoples words for this. I have literally gone through every single mod in the mod pack and in the cases where general permissions for inclusion in mod packs isnt given in the respective threads, I have approached the actual mod authors for their views. So the answer to the question is No they do not have a full set of permissions, however they are REALLY close to it. From the best of what I can gather, they are at most missing permissions for 3 maybe 4 mods. All the other mods in the pack either give general consents to all packs or the author doesnt care enough about technic or tekkit to say yes or no.
So what is the big huge problem. Well from my own personal point of view the legalities aside its down to pure respect. I want to very quickly reference something here.
http://forum.industrial-craft.net/index.php?page=Thread&postID=28356#post28356
This isnt hearsay or anything like that, these are Kakermix's own words. This is one mod maker very clearly stating in public that technic does not have consent to use the mod and yet they continue to do so. I see no possible valid excuse for this. Whether or not it is legal, it is damn sure disrespectful to the creator. The following line from post number 65 is very informative
'I did not get permission from anyone and I didn't even bother asking. The Minecraft modding community is terrible and the egos some of the modders themselves have is incredibly terrible. I simply made this pack because I love these mods and want other people to experience them as well with as little work on their part as possible.'
And yet just 3 posts earlier we see a post that contains the line
'Nobody knows that we are friends with Eloraam, or that Ablaka was the first to give us permission, or that Xenophobe has always been thankful for us, or that Technic and the Yogscast is directly responsible for Thaumcraft being created.'
They are right in one thing nobody does know any of the information in that sentence, because quite frankly (and yes I have spoken directly to the Mod Authors) that sentence belongs in the Fiction Section of the local library.
Now having said all this, there are a few other things that I believe need to be made clear. Technic and Tekkit are really good ideas, there was a time a while back Where some of the modders tried to talk to the guys behind technicpack to resolve the issues. Attempts were made and they got nowhere. At the time this was no huge surprise because they still had one major hurdle to get over and that was the policies of Risugami with regards to the re-distribution of ModLoader. I have no idea if Technic had consent. However I can tell you that the response that we were given is that it is or was Risu's policy that you could re-distribute ModLoader as long as you did not ask permission to re-distribute it. As soon as you asked for permission, those implied permissions were revoked (unless you happened to catch Risu on a good day. I do know a couple of people who were given permission.) This was fine but this information wasnt conveyed anywhere. This meant that pretty much all mod packs that used launchers were breaking at the very least the minecraft forum rules which state that you have to have clear written permissions to promote your pack on the minecraft forums.
Getting back to the point. Technic and Tekkit as a pack are good idea's they are just implemented by people who generally dont care about the makers of the mods. They hide behind the line of 'We dont advertise permissions because it is pointless and if you dont believe us then well whatever.' This however does not apply to the users of the Techniclauncher. At the end of the day they just want the same thing as everyone else in this thread. An easy way to play Minecraft with mods without having to mess around. Further, when they play on servers, they want to be able to just give their friends a link say run this and let go screw around on a server. Thats what technic and tekkit provide and until now they have never really had anything serious in the way of competition. But we are not out to Get technic or have them burn in the fires of hell. We are just here to provide an alternative. Primarily I built a mod pack so people could easily play my maps. Now the mod pack is there so people can just enjoy playing minecraft the way I like to play it.
Before I finish off there is one other important point I would like to make here. Maybe correcting the biggest misconception there is with regards to the users of Technic and Tekkit. and that is adfly links. The reason mod makers dont want to see their mods in technic and tekkit is not because of some obscure belief that they want to protect and preserve the incomes they derive from these links. Whilst those incomes are helpful to some, it is not the be all and end all. However I can tell everyone this which should hopefully prove this point. I have spoken to a lot of the mod makers that are included in the FTB pack. Not just over the last week, but over the last several months. In that entire time with only one exception, every modmaker has not only granted me permission to use the mods in the mod pack but a lot of them have also been completely supportive in actually helping to add features needed.
My assumption is that if what the technic people say has been true all along, then they would be in full support of this mod pack and what we are trying to achieve. After all we all want the same thing, we are just going about it in different ways.
Anyways this is already FAR to long. However I hope it is slightly informative to at least a few people.
Slowpoke.
So, you do have Azanor's permission for TC3, then? He didn't post on the permissions thread, but if you have approached him personally, that's awesome.
So, um, are all the mod makers pretty good friends with each other and you?
Question 1: Yes
Question 2: Yes
EDIT: I mean, I don't mean to pry, but have the forum admins just not gotten around to it yet? Or is their another announcement that I missed?
I don't
I myself am not a modder. I am just a regular minecrafter and the community as a whole has been shaken by this subject. I wish that the community could be a peace and this mod pack shows that there is light at the end of the tunnel. You may not understand what this will mean. To stop the bickering. To make an end to so much controversy. You maybe on to something here. The pack will never end all the fuel but hopefully. You can help the fire raging inside of the beast and let the modding community be at rest. Thank you for reading. I hope you take this into consideration.