RP2 is a great mod, and I can feel for Eloram for having a hard personal life and not being able to update very quickly. However, when many people rely on you to update your mod because it's holding up multiple major mod packs, it becomes a huge problem.
Eloram has essentially lost her integrity, because RP is the mod that's keeping most modpacks from updating to 1.5 while we're on the verge of 1.6.
RP2 is a great mod, and I can feel for Eloram for having a hard personal life and not being able to update very quickly. However, when many people rely on you to update your mod because it's holding up multiple major mod packs, it becomes a huge problem.
Eloram has essentially lost her integrity, because RP is the mod that's keeping most modpacks from updating to 1.5 while we're on the verge of 1.6.
Ultimately it's her mod, and we all choose to use RedPower. We could easily stop using it, and the mod packs could remove it. Sure, it's annoying that RP is always the last mod to be updated whenever there's a new MC version, but that's the choice we make.
Forge wasn't started by Eloraam, but by SpaceToad. And as far as I'm aware she hasn't done much work on Forge since LexManos took over, which is over a year. So if it's anybody's team working on Forge it's LexManos's.
Elo did lay a lot of the groundwork for forge in the first versions, most importantly the ore dictionary which was her idea, but I doubt much of her original code is still there, specially after the 1.2 rewrite of Forge.
The Forge team works on Forge. No one but Eloraam, to my knowledge, works on advancing the development of RedPower2. Only one other person was given permission to publicly release any variant of RedPower 2, Maeyanie, and that was simply to allow her to port RedPower 2 over to the Bukkit builds.
Was. Eloraam has been inactive with Forge since before it was taken over by cpw and LexManos. Following the retirement of SpaceToad and FC-Elo drama, Forge was left without a maintainer until Lex and cpw stepped up to save the abandoned open-source project. At this point Eloraam is just as responsible for Forge as FlowerChild and SpaceToad (ie: barely. responsible). Her twitter even points to an occurrence of RP2 and Forge breaking until cpw fixes and informs her that all is well again.
No... really she doesn't. Go find the MinecraftForge project on Github and link the last commit to the code base from Eloraam. And to imply that the Forge Team is there to serve Eloramm does a great disservice to cpw and LexManos, as does attributing their hard work to Eloraam, who hasn't been directly involved with Forge for well over a year.
Eloraam has worked with Forge for a while. She currently is the project leader for both lighting modification and the ore directory, both of which haven't any sources on Github for Lighting modification is still in primary development and has no substantial coding to be posted, and ore directory is really only changed for bugs. However, even without participation at the high rate, she still is considered a member of the forge team.
As for saying the Elo has a team, you have all misinterpreted me completely. Especially Saul (for which I have no idea how you could go that far as saying that I think the Forge team serves Eloraam. A big WTF to you buddy). I am saying that many ideas for the extended hooks for Forge came from Eloraam's work. Although Elo hasn't coded on many of them, Elo is the one who said "Hey, lets do this" which gives her credit for having the original idea and telling them how it was possible. Many of the ideas were sought to improve features in RP that could also improve other mods. The team has countless times improved and added features to Forge that were suggested by Eloraam to improve the ability of RP, but also improve other mods and add more manipulations to Minecraft overall. Forge is technically a team to Eloraam in a sense. She comes up with an idea, they manage to make it (having more free time), and she uses it in RP. Many features would not exist without the work of The Forge team, where in which the work would not exist without Eloraam. You can see that many other mods of any person who was at some point a main dev and still a communicator the team has the same relationship. They suggest a feature that would improve many mods that originates from the seeking to improve their own, and thus it is added. It is a very long cycle that produces some of the best hooks in Forge we have seen, and still does.
Hello, I would like to use your mod for a youtube series with me and my friend. We will be using a custom mod pack.
Of course, I will give full credit to you, i.e. "Redpower by Eloraam. Link: *link*"
I will give you full credit for your mod, and I can understand if you say no, or are not able to respond to this.
I will not make this modpack public.
Let me sum up the most recent posts on the last serveral pages of this thread in one word: "CONTROVERSY"
Whatever ever happened to Redpower Discussions..?, why did it change to Elo discussions... This is the MOD page for talking about the MOD.. not the mod author page, for talking about the mod author.
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No worries, once enough of the nerdlings take up their torches and pitchforks she will appear with a few tweets about how busy she is and that the update is coming.
She knows by now that that is enough to calm the villagers down for at least another month. Rinse, repeat and they fall for it every time. Any that are not calmed down Eloraam's Paladins™ will ride in to try and deal with the stragglers.
No worries, once enough of the nerdlings take up their torches and pitchforks she will appear with a few tweets about how busy she is and that the update is coming.
She knows by now that that is enough to calm the villagers down for at least another month. Rinse, repeat and they fall for it every time. Any that are not calmed down Eloraam's Paladins™ will ride in to try and deal with the stragglers.
Ok that was a funny post i got to admit.... but unless you good sir can point us into the direction of a RP2 replacement STFU about Elo she is the best modder going anyone else have the guts/skills to try todo frames??? i didnt think so....
Am i a RP2 "Paladin" as you claim because i refuse to update without it?.... Guess so......
1) Eloraam has worked with Forge for a while.
2) She currently is the project leader for both lighting modification and the ore directory
3) I have no idea how you could go that far as saying that I think the Forge team serves Eloraam.
4) I am saying that many ideas for the extended hooks ; Elo is the one who said "Hey, lets do this" which gives her credit for having the original idea and telling them how it was possible.
1) & 2) Eloraam was one of several developers that initiated the Forge project and I think that you are operating on information that is dated and has lost it's relevancy. The Ore Dictionary has been implemented since pre-1.8.1 and the lighting engine evolved into Minia (or Zeta (or whatever)) and is unreleased. If you feel that my views are flawed please cite (current) references to support your information.
...see? You said it right there... The Forge Team is Eloraams... If somebody 'has' a team then that team typically works to that persons ends. My point was that Eloraam does not have a team and that the Forge developers are an entity seperate from that of RedPower. LexManos and cpw do not work on RP2 therefore they are NOT part of Eloraams team. See previous point re: Eloraams recent Forge activitites. Other than that- Eloraam is the only person that does anything related to RedPower. One person is not a team.
4) awesome attempt at maintaining civility there... ... ...buddy.
5) In the beginning. But once again, Eloraam became less active and Lex and cpw together with the mod developers that needed the hooks are responsible for the current state of Forge. At this point every other Forge mod developer gets just as much credit as Eloraam for the extended hooks that the API provides. Ideas are trivial- Implementation is all that truly matters and that credit goes to Lex and cpw.
6) Seriously...? It's Mojangs fault for updating and breaking RP2? You do realize that RP2 for 1.4.6 still works with 1.4.6 right? Mojang deserves precisely zero blame for there not being an RP2 for 1.5.x. The idea that someone would blame a game producer for making a mod outdated is completely and utterly preposterous.
H eloraam, I would just like to let you know that I'm thinking of using your mod in a custom pack I'm putting together that will be publicly available. I don't even have a topic yet and the pack will be distributed over adfly unfortunately I can't think of a way to put in a tag in for you saying "redpower by eloram" so that won't be in their either. If I don't get a reply from you within a short while ill assume you don't have a problem with this.
Thanks
Eloram has essentially lost her integrity, because RP is the mod that's keeping most modpacks from updating to 1.5 while we're on the verge of 1.6.
Your logic is flawed. A lack of integrity means she would have to have broken her word in some way. She never promised a release date for anything or even that she would continue to develop this mod beyond 1.4.6. Rather, it seems the community has lost their patience for a free mod and are blaming the results of their groundless dissatisfaction and bad attitudes all on her.
Eloraam doesn't owe us anything. If she wished to drop everything and give up RP altogether that would be her prerogative and she would be well within her margin of ethics to do that if she so wished. People may be upset and saddened over this, but that does not mean that she has lost any integrity or that she's a bad person in some way at all. She would simply have moved on. Our dissatisfaction with that scenario is not her fault. It's not anybody's fault. It just sucks, that's all. But life sucks sometimes. Get over it. We have heard no word that she even gave up on it anyway. So this scenario is borderline worst-case and will probably not happen. So suck it up.
1) Your logic is flawed. A lack of integrity means she would have to have broken her word in some way. She never promised a release date for anything or even that she would continue to develop this mod beyond 1.4.6.
The following quotes all point to some form of release beyond the initial 1.4.6 release, in addition- a statement of 'not retiring' implies the further development that you denied the existence of.
Eloraam @TheRealEloraam28 Dec
So I hear that Forge build 490 isn't compatible with PR6. Just taking a little holiday downtime, will get to bug fixing soon. Eloraam @TheRealEloraam19 Feb
Back on RP full-time now. Lots of surprises coming, but first, I'll likely be releasing a new bugfix for 1.4.6 and a port to 1.5. Eloraam @TheRealEloraam17 Apr
I won't risk ETA predictions but the work project that dragged me away ended yesterday and I'm feeling like playing Minecraft again.
and that's just for the 1.4.x > 1.5.x cycle. Pretty much the same thing for the 1.2.5 > 1.4.x cycle. Eloraam would be within her rights to do all of the things that you mentioned but at some point a developer has to acknowledge the fact that their project has become vapor-ware and get out of the way. Even the act of not responding to permission requests as per her requirements serves to diminish her integrity.
1) the pack will be distributed over adfly
2) I can't think of a way to put in a tag in for you saying "redpower by eloram" so that won't be in their either.
3) If I don't get a reply from you within a short while ill assume you don't have a problem with this.
Not how it works. You need express permission to use the mod, kinda the point of requiring people to have permission.
1) Use of ad.fly is expressly forbidden by the terms in the OP.
2) Attribution is a requirement, either on the release thread, web site or in an included text file.
3) Not getting a reply 'within a short while' is not being given permission. Permission is the author stating 'I authorize this' or something to the effect of, permission is not the sound of crickets chirping.
Not how it works. You need express permission to use the mod, kinda the point of requiring people to have permission.
1) Use of ad.fly is expressly forbidden by the terms in the OP.
2) Attribution is a requirement, either on the release thread, web site or in an included text file.
3) Not getting a reply 'within a short while' is not being given permission. Permission is the author stating 'I authorize this' or something to the effect of, permission is not the sound of crickets chirping.
Who cares? Shes gone and not coming back so why not just throw the mod to the dogs and lets see what they come up with?
Your logic is flawed. A lack of integrity means she would have to have broken her word in some way. She never promised a release date for anything or even that she would continue to develop this mod beyond 1.4.6. Rather, it seems the community has lost their patience for a free mod and are blaming the results of their groundless dissatisfaction and bad attitudes all on her.
Eloraam doesn't owe us anything. If she wished to drop everything and give up RP altogether that would be her prerogative and she would be well within her margin of ethics to do that if she so wished. People may be upset and saddened over this, but that does not mean that she has lost any integrity or that she's a bad person in some way at all. She would simply have moved on. Our dissatisfaction with that scenario is not her fault. It's not anybody's fault. It just sucks, that's all. But life sucks sometimes. Get over it. We have heard no word that she even gave up on it anyway. So this scenario is borderline worst-case and will probably not happen. So suck it up.
Here's the flaw in your logic.
Redpower is 'managed' by someone who doesn't have the time to look after it. This person may have the right to do as they want with it but they need to realise that if they wish to turn it into abandonware then they need to either appoint someone to take over, open source the project or simply admit they have no time and allow someone else to update it without having to deal with copyright etc.
If she has moved on then she could admit it and at least try and give the mod a future (think how space toad ended his work on the buildcraft project).
If she doesn't have the time she and she wants to keep working on it she could have someone co write it with her, even if just to update it.
If she truly wants to keep it she could at least show some commitment to it and work towards its updating.
An idea I have found before that seams to apply here: there are three feature a person and their project should have to be perfect and two out of three of which will still make a good project. A) the person can be punctual the person could be liked and C) ther project could be good.
Redpower is often late. Redpower is a good mod. Eloram is not disliked as such but has turned into a recluse and gives no sign of existing aside from the occasional "you've broken my copyrighb, ban this person" (happened on ic2 forums) whilst we don't expect her to be constantly on here she could actualy tell us what she is doing with it. Take the irc for example, most of the time it is "update is coming, here's a donation link" from ages ago.
We don't hate eloram and we respect the fact that she may have a busy life, it just that we wish there would be more respect almost for her project and that its continued existence could be guaranteed.
'Cause she might decide not to throw the next version to the dogs - those moaning pesky players that achieved nothing.
Congratulations.. That actually breaks all conditions for modpack from the OP
I'm hoping you got the sarcasm, from some of the above responses I tough someone was going to completely not get it and report me/have me banned. We seriously need a punctuation marks for sarcasm/humour/irony for the Internet.
I see this as your last ditch attempt to lure her into posting. Won't work!
You are going to do whatever you damned well please regardless.
Both your logic and your morals are corrupt! You win a one way trip to ignoresville
Lou
You know what would be interesting, if people in Internet arguments could see each others IRL (not meant in a violent way).
I hereby concede that I am wasting my time on redpower and will try to move on. Either way i think it would have been funny if the persons who implied that I am ignorant could see how very much this statement would apply to them.
Of course it looked suspicious.
Unfortunately there were already many who would mean such request seriously.
+ the forum has been recently filling with RP2-irrelevant crap not worth thorough reading.
Of course it has, mod forums only contain actualy interesting and relative content when the mod is roughly in date.
Once redpower starts lagging behind it fills with people screaming for updates and is eventually shifted into the WIP mod section.
add:\ BTW- re: Unauthorized 1.5.x RP2 port.... doesn't really matter considering that other mods have *malware* in them that check for unauthorized ports of other mods and crash the game. (Railcraft... looking at you)
Just wanted to say, I think you are confused about malware.
As per Wikipedia:
Malware, short for malicious (or malevolent) software, is software used or programmed by attackers to disrupt computer operation, gather sensitive information, or gain access to private computer systems. It can appear in the form of code, scripts, active content, and other software. 'Malware' is a general term used to refer to a variety of forms of hostile or intrusive software.
Also it seems that I just had a tree overwrite a chest with it's leaves. (running RP2, SC2, forge 6.5.0.467)
EDIT: I am not sure about it. I might have hit it with that superspeedy sickle?
Just wanted to say, I think you are confused about malware.
As per Wikipedia:
Malware, short for malicious (or malevolent) software, is software used or programmed by attackers to disrupt computer operation, gather sensitive information, or gain access to private computer systems. It can appear in the form of code, scripts, active content, and other software. 'Malware' is a general term used to refer to a variety of forms of hostile or intrusive software.
What Railcraft does isn't malicious.
Nope... not confused at all. As you can see by the bolded part of the definition that you provided- what Railcraft does is malicious
ma·li·cious (m-lshs) adj.
1) Having the nature of or resulting from malice; deliberately harmful; spiteful: malicious gossip.
2) A desire to harm others or to see others suffer; extreme ill will or spite.
...I'd say that crashing the game with no error message would be intended to 'disrupt computer operation' in a way that is 'deliberately harmful'. Considering the motivators that led up to the inclusion of said code, I'd say it was rather 'spiteful' and was a result of 'extreme ill will'.
This is a discussion in and of itself. Unfortunately it's also off-topic in this thread. If you want to debate me on this do it through PMs. (or not... people deserve to know about stuff like this)
RP2 is a great mod, and I can feel for Eloram for having a hard personal life and not being able to update very quickly. However, when many people rely on you to update your mod because it's holding up multiple major mod packs, it becomes a huge problem.
Eloram has essentially lost her integrity, because RP is the mod that's keeping most modpacks from updating to 1.5 while we're on the verge of 1.6.
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Curse PremiumUltimately it's her mod, and we all choose to use RedPower. We could easily stop using it, and the mod packs could remove it. Sure, it's annoying that RP is always the last mod to be updated whenever there's a new MC version, but that's the choice we make.
Eloraam has worked with Forge for a while. She currently is the project leader for both lighting modification and the ore directory, both of which haven't any sources on Github for Lighting modification is still in primary development and has no substantial coding to be posted, and ore directory is really only changed for bugs. However, even without participation at the high rate, she still is considered a member of the forge team.
As for saying the Elo has a team, you have all misinterpreted me completely. Especially Saul (for which I have no idea how you could go that far as saying that I think the Forge team serves Eloraam. A big WTF to you buddy). I am saying that many ideas for the extended hooks for Forge came from Eloraam's work. Although Elo hasn't coded on many of them, Elo is the one who said "Hey, lets do this" which gives her credit for having the original idea and telling them how it was possible. Many of the ideas were sought to improve features in RP that could also improve other mods. The team has countless times improved and added features to Forge that were suggested by Eloraam to improve the ability of RP, but also improve other mods and add more manipulations to Minecraft overall. Forge is technically a team to Eloraam in a sense. She comes up with an idea, they manage to make it (having more free time), and she uses it in RP. Many features would not exist without the work of The Forge team, where in which the work would not exist without Eloraam. You can see that many other mods of any person who was at some point a main dev and still a communicator the team has the same relationship. They suggest a feature that would improve many mods that originates from the seeking to improve their own, and thus it is added. It is a very long cycle that produces some of the best hooks in Forge we have seen, and still does.
Of course, I will give full credit to you, i.e. "Redpower by Eloraam. Link: *link*"
I will give you full credit for your mod, and I can understand if you say no, or are not able to respond to this.
I will not make this modpack public.
Thanks
Whatever ever happened to Redpower Discussions..?, why did it change to Elo discussions... This is the MOD page for talking about the MOD.. not the mod author page, for talking about the mod author.
She knows by now that that is enough to calm the villagers down for at least another month. Rinse, repeat and they fall for it every time. Any that are not calmed down Eloraam's Paladins™ will ride in to try and deal with the stragglers.
Ok that was a funny post i got to admit.... but unless you good sir can point us into the direction of a RP2 replacement STFU about Elo she is the best modder going
Am i a RP2 "Paladin" as you claim because i refuse to update without it?.... Guess so......
1) & 2) Eloraam was one of several developers that initiated the Forge project and I think that you are operating on information that is dated and has lost it's relevancy. The Ore Dictionary has been implemented since pre-1.8.1 and the lighting engine evolved into Minia (or Zeta (or whatever)) and is unreleased. If you feel that my views are flawed please cite (current) references to support your information.
3) Because you said it?
...see? You said it right there... The Forge Team is Eloraams... If somebody 'has' a team then that team typically works to that persons ends. My point was that Eloraam does not have a team and that the Forge developers are an entity seperate from that of RedPower. LexManos and cpw do not work on RP2 therefore they are NOT part of Eloraams team. See previous point re: Eloraams recent Forge activitites. Other than that- Eloraam is the only person that does anything related to RedPower. One person is not a team.
4) awesome attempt at maintaining civility there... ... ...buddy.
5) In the beginning. But once again, Eloraam became less active and Lex and cpw together with the mod developers that needed the hooks are responsible for the current state of Forge. At this point every other Forge mod developer gets just as much credit as Eloraam for the extended hooks that the API provides. Ideas are trivial- Implementation is all that truly matters and that credit goes to Lex and cpw.
6) Seriously...? It's Mojangs fault for updating and breaking RP2? You do realize that RP2 for 1.4.6 still works with 1.4.6 right? Mojang deserves precisely zero blame for there not being an RP2 for 1.5.x. The idea that someone would blame a game producer for making a mod outdated is completely and utterly preposterous.
Thanks
1) Signatures, 2) Irony, 3) Lists
Your logic is flawed. A lack of integrity means she would have to have broken her word in some way. She never promised a release date for anything or even that she would continue to develop this mod beyond 1.4.6. Rather, it seems the community has lost their patience for a free mod and are blaming the results of their groundless dissatisfaction and bad attitudes all on her.
Eloraam doesn't owe us anything. If she wished to drop everything and give up RP altogether that would be her prerogative and she would be well within her margin of ethics to do that if she so wished. People may be upset and saddened over this, but that does not mean that she has lost any integrity or that she's a bad person in some way at all. She would simply have moved on. Our dissatisfaction with that scenario is not her fault. It's not anybody's fault. It just sucks, that's all. But life sucks sometimes. Get over it. We have heard no word that she even gave up on it anyway. So this scenario is borderline worst-case and will probably not happen. So suck it up.
The following quotes all point to some form of release beyond the initial 1.4.6 release, in addition- a statement of 'not retiring' implies the further development that you denied the existence of.
Eloraam
@TheRealEloraam 28 DecSo I hear that Forge build 490 isn't compatible with PR6. Just taking a little holiday downtime, will get to bug fixing soon.
Eloraam
@TheRealEloraam 19 FebBack on RP full-time now. Lots of surprises coming, but first, I'll likely be releasing a new bugfix for 1.4.6 and a port to 1.5.
Eloraam
@TheRealEloraam 17 AprI won't risk ETA predictions but the work project that dragged me away ended yesterday and I'm feeling like playing Minecraft again.
and that's just for the 1.4.x > 1.5.x cycle. Pretty much the same thing for the 1.2.5 > 1.4.x cycle. Eloraam would be within her rights to do all of the things that you mentioned but at some point a developer has to acknowledge the fact that their project has become vapor-ware and get out of the way. Even the act of not responding to permission requests as per her requirements serves to diminish her integrity.
Not how it works. You need express permission to use the mod, kinda the point of requiring people to have permission.
1) Use of ad.fly is expressly forbidden by the terms in the OP.
2) Attribution is a requirement, either on the release thread, web site or in an included text file.
3) Not getting a reply 'within a short while' is not being given permission. Permission is the author stating 'I authorize this' or something to the effect of, permission is not the sound of crickets chirping.
Who cares? Shes gone and not coming back so why not just throw the mod to the dogs and lets see what they come up with?
Here's the flaw in your logic.
Redpower is 'managed' by someone who doesn't have the time to look after it. This person may have the right to do as they want with it but they need to realise that if they wish to turn it into abandonware then they need to either appoint someone to take over, open source the project or simply admit they have no time and allow someone else to update it without having to deal with copyright etc.
If she has moved on then she could admit it and at least try and give the mod a future (think how space toad ended his work on the buildcraft project).
If she doesn't have the time she and she wants to keep working on it she could have someone co write it with her, even if just to update it.
If she truly wants to keep it she could at least show some commitment to it and work towards its updating.
An idea I have found before that seams to apply here: there are three feature a person and their project should have to be perfect and two out of three of which will still make a good project. A) the person can be punctual
Redpower is often late. Redpower is a good mod. Eloram is not disliked as such but has turned into a recluse and gives no sign of existing aside from the occasional "you've broken my copyrighb, ban this person" (happened on ic2 forums) whilst we don't expect her to be constantly on here she could actualy tell us what she is doing with it. Take the irc for example, most of the time it is "update is coming, here's a donation link" from ages ago.
We don't hate eloram and we respect the fact that she may have a busy life, it just that we wish there would be more respect almost for her project and that its continued existence could be guaranteed.
I'm hoping you got the sarcasm, from some of the above responses I tough someone was going to completely not get it and report me/have me banned. We seriously need a punctuation marks for sarcasm/humour/irony for the Internet.
1) Signatures, 2) Irony, 3) Lists
I see this as your last ditch attempt to lure her into posting. Won't work!
You are going to do whatever you damned well please regardless.
Both your logic and your morals are corrupt! You win a one way trip to ignoresville
Lou
Links to pdf format, downloadable, command lists for (these often clarify/expand descriptions, and where possible link to the author's posting):
MoreCommands: http://www.mediafire.com/view/qjc9c6klcnp660e/CmdLstMoreCommands.pdf
WorldEdit: http://www.mediafire.com/view/bi7r00xd9rgxrrt/WE_Commands.pdf
I hereby concede that I am wasting my time on redpower and will try to move on. Either way i think it would have been funny if the persons who implied that I am ignorant could see how very much this statement would apply to them.
1) Signatures, 2) Irony, 3) Lists
Of course it has, mod forums only contain actualy interesting and relative content when the mod is roughly in date.
Once redpower starts lagging behind it fills with people screaming for updates and is eventually shifted into the WIP mod section.
1) Signatures, 2) Irony, 3) Lists
Just wanted to say, I think you are confused about malware.
As per Wikipedia:
That is an ongoing issue from 1.4.7
Nope... not confused at all. As you can see by the bolded part of the definition that you provided- what Railcraft does is malicious
...I'd say that crashing the game with no error message would be intended to 'disrupt computer operation' in a way that is 'deliberately harmful'. Considering the motivators that led up to the inclusion of said code, I'd say it was rather 'spiteful' and was a result of 'extreme ill will'.
This is a discussion in and of itself. Unfortunately it's also off-topic in this thread. If you want to debate me on this do it through PMs. (or not... people deserve to know about stuff like this)