Thanks for you sarcasim Is there a pretty with really.. really ..>REALLY liking a particular map?
Grim did a great job with the titan map series. Its pretty freaking fun so far! http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/maps/1555869-the-source-series-by-grimdeath
Its the first time i've ever played a 'build the machine' type of CTM map. Kinda a cool concept. I wish they would make the CTM
style of maps an actual difficulty level or "seed" for the launcher itself. It would def. add a lot more excitement in the vanilla game itself
i was thinking the same, I thought about it a bit... He's trying to give different levels to make the loot progression smooth, however he used the wrong words to describe the tiers. I think the "legendary" and "common" kind of terminology should be used to determine the quality of the item. in most cases, the higher the quality, the harder it is to find/acquire. The "common" in intersection 2 could be equivalent to the "uncommon" in intersection 1... As the fifth intersection's "common" would be equivalent to intersection 1's "mythical".
Idk. This doesn't make sense to me. Legendary items =/= super op items necessarily. The way I see it, you should be able to find a legendary item (legendary meaning rare and special) in the 1st intersection as much as in the 4th intersection.
The fact that you have it so that common items are found in the first intersection and not in the other intersections sounds ridiculous. Common doesn't mean "weak" or "bad". It really does mean common, as in "found often". If you don't find that item in any intersection but the 1st one, how is it common?
Well that wasn't what i intended, I was trying to define it as a certain item will be found often, like a Level 1 Battle Minecart is something that would be common and pretty much in 1/3 chests you find, something Mythical would be in like 1/50 chests in the whole of intersection 5, i meant it more of a rarity but as you go to higher intersections common loot dissapeared and is replaced by higher tier loot, not that it's only found in that intersection, like a Common item would not show up in intersection 4, the lowest rarity would be a rare/uncommon item.. should have clarified this
i was thinking the same, I thought about it a bit... He's trying to give different levels to make the loot progression smooth, however he used the wrong words to describe the tiers. I think the "legendary" and "common" kind of terminology should be used to determine the quality of the item. in most cases, the higher the quality, the harder it is to find/acquire. The "common" in intersection 2 could be equivalent to the "uncommon" in intersection 1... As the fifth intersection's "common" would be equivalent to intersection 1's "mythical".
See above response.
i was intending that like a Common item will have weak enchants and no attributes. something like a Rare item would have at max 3 enchants and 2 Attributes, yet a Mythical item would be like so.
Mjölnir, The Hammer[/header]
Sharp IV
Smite II
Bane III
KB III
Unbr X
Attributes
-5% Speed
+0.9 KB resist
+5 Attack damage (iron axe)
+6 Max Health
that would be a Mythical item as it has 5 enchants and 4 attributes, it's more relative to power levels than rarity, if that makes sense
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CTM maker, Rom-Hack Hard Enthusiast, Lover of Tacos and Coder
I'd love feedback on my map. It's not technically a CTM, but it's style is very similar.
It's basically a CTM with a greater emphasis on puzzles, custom enemies, and special items. Oh wait...
Anyways, the primary goal isn't wool collections so it doesn't technically fit the category, but like I said, it plays similarly.
I'd appreciate it if someone would check it out and tell me how I can improve it.
Hi and welcome, glad to see a new face here. Always good to see new mapmakers, and you seem to know command blocks already, great!
"Currently, I've only worked on level design; it doesn't have spawners, items, or monsters yet."
This sounds really controversial to me? Level design is about, well, designing the level, right? How much of a level is there if there's nothing to do?
I'm picking this out because it's a mistake I see so many (newer) CTM mapmakers make, and I want to try help you get over it quickly. See, a map stands or fails with its gameplay, aesthetics are mostly needed for getting peoples attention in the first place. And if you make a level, without knowing what spawner or loot goes where, you lose 80% of the gameplay already. Gameplay isn't about the type of mob, or about the OPness of a sword in a chest. It's about how the environment is setup, how the player will go through an area. This is true for an area that takes 2 hours to complete, but also for half a ledge in a small room inside that area.
Actually when I meant level design, I meant gameplay. I want the aesthetics to be nice yet, but I'm actually more concerned with how the level plays out. I don't have the spawners and loot in because I want to finish the dungeon before I start working out what the appropriate balance is. However, do have the locations marked out with signs. I know where I want things, I just haven't worked out how much or what. And thanks a ton for responding!
Actually when I meant level design, I meant gameplay. I want the aesthetics to be nice yet, but I'm actually more concerned with how the level plays out. I don't have the spawners and loot in because I want to finish the dungeon before I start working out what the appropriate balance is. However, do have the locations marked out with signs. I know where I want things, I just haven't worked out how much or what. And thanks a ton for responding!
That's actually good. Marking stuff can work too, but remember to eventually stop planning and run a test to see if stuff works out the way you hoped. It's so easy to just keep mapping then to realize that it didn't work out ;-)
Does anyone have any interesting ideas for loot for my Series YT9R? There aren't many weapons in Norse Mythos that I can find. I was thinking of making a diamond sword called "Ragnarok's Torment" with Smite VI, KB III and +0.6 KB Resist with +6 Health as a [Legendary Item] Any other ideas for Loot related to Norse Mythology?
With attributes you can change the playstyle of the map with one item, Attributes are crazy fun to mess with. [Legendary Item] are really rare in my series, around the Blue Wool is where you can find a blade like that, it basically kills normal undeads in 1-2 shots. It's a strong late game item but isn't OP as the monsters scale HP as you go on, zombies in White Wool areas will have 7HP and zombies in the Blue-Black will have around 25HP so you can't 1 shot them and steam roll the map as you get more gear.
My gear system is laid out like so.
[Common Item] 1st Intersection
[Uncommon Item] 2nd Intersection
[Rare Item] 3rd Intersection
[Legendary Item] 4th Intersection
[Mythical Item] 5th Intersection or really hidden in the 4th Intersection
Mythicals will be extremely rare and hidden in Lapis Chest Rooms (like in Inferno Mines) and really hard to find, maybe even special hidden bonus loot dungeons. Loot is fun to balance with a Rarity System
That doesn't seem particularly well designed to me. It doesn't leave you any space to create special and good items in early intersections, and really your system only serves to tell you which intersection you got it at. That seems almost useless to me. Why bother to call them "Common", "Uncommon", ect as if it's a rarity list, when it's not that at all?
That doesn't seem particularly well designed to me. It doesn't leave you any space to create special and good items in early intersections, and really your system only serves to tell you which intersection you got it at. That seems almost useless to me. Why bother to call them "Common", "Uncommon", ect as if it's a rarity list, when it's not that at all?
hmm I see your point, I will change it up before I use it... giving them a name like "Bad Item" doesn't really fit.... I could go with [Battle Scarred Item], {Slightly Worn Item] [Freshly Smithed] , [Masterly Smithed Item] and [Heavenly Smithed Item] would that make more sense? the higher the intersection the more effort that was put into it by the forger?
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CTM maker, Rom-Hack Hard Enthusiast, Lover of Tacos and Coder
First off- Loot is useless if the player would not reasonably use it. It must be useful, even if it's useful in only niche circumstances. The exception to this is 'filler' loot which fills a chest and is obviously just there to make the chest layout nicer, e.g. bones arranged to look like a skeleton, or string scattered about in a spider dungeon.
Second- Loot should ideally be easy to spot. So chests shouldn't be hidden under trees or at y256. At a minute level, the chest layout should ideally be structured in such a way that the player will know where to look, e.g. Weapons and armour in the top left and food in the top right... Players should be able to glance inside, take what they need, then leap back into the action. Almost every one of the loot chests in Savage Realm are structured in a specific style, inspired by Amlup's logical design. It works for me, and made loot placement that much easier for me.
No, I don't think so. I think loot is more there to reward the player for what they've accomplished. This can be a reward for finding a secret, beating a dungeon, or just exploring the other room that had no objective in it. If you look at it that way, loot doesn't have to be useful all the time. In fact, it doese't have to have any use at all, if it's cool in itself. Giving the player something fun can be good too, or something that is just cool too look add.
With this, loot also regulates the tools the player has at their disposal. Most of your tools come from loot, and so you can use loot to give the player access to different strategies of clearing areas. Not all loot are supplies. It can be a stack of tnt that's only good for that specific area, or a water bucket, a key to a door somewhere, or a utility item. Setting every chest up the same way makes loot just one big "supply" number that the mapmaker regulates.
@redstone why bother naming stuff between intersections? It's not 100% necessary to even increase the quality of the loot, since if you increase mob quality as well that doese't really do much. But if you want better loot, you could just make it better without giving it another name? Numbers are numbers, gameplay is gameplay. Those are 2 completely different things.
Hmm....haven't had a proper discussion or a CQ about this in a while....
Community Question:
What do you think loot systems should do in a CTM map? Why do you use your loot system? What is your favorite loot system?
(Yes, it's more than one question technially. Deal with it )
i like loot systems, it gives more of a RPG, story driven feel, which is well sone in maps like Simulation Protocall II and RageCraft II: Insomnia, I am indecisive right now, waiting from feedback form Fang, my favorite loot system is from SP II: Overload, it's so well done
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CTM maker, Rom-Hack Hard Enthusiast, Lover of Tacos and Coder
When you have an open world map placing an appropriate amount of loot in each spot of an appropriate level becomes a bit of a major balancing act. Your almost forced to limit loot to being at just the ends of dungeons to keep things balanced...
hmm I see your point, I will change it up before I use it... giving them a name like "Bad Item" doesn't really fit.... I could go with [Battle Scarred Item], {Slightly Worn Item] [Freshly Smithed] , [Masterly Smithed Item] and [Heavenly Smithed Item] would that make more sense? the higher the intersection the more effort that was put into it by the forger?
Basically, if you want loot tiers, make loot tiers. Common items would be your basic tier items for your zone. Early game? That could mean wood. Late, that could mean Iron gear. Let your loot tiers adjust naturally over the course of your map.
In Septum, for example, I have a few tiers and types of available. I've got my normal colored tiers of loot, and then some unique and special items on different tiers. I also do sort items by areas, to make life easier for me as a whole, however, the "Basic", "Common", ect tiers evolve as the map progresses, where, as I mentioned above, what those Common items are get higher tier, being better than what a "Mythic" item could have been back at the first set of areas.
Hmm....haven't had a proper discussion or a CQ about this in a while....
Community Question:
What do you think loot systems should do in a CTM map? Why do you use your loot system? What is your favorite loot system?
(Yes, it's more than one question technially. Deal with it )
I'm with Rubisk, Loot's a reward. I prefer to only give the bare minimum loot for free. Everything else has to be earned. Secret rooms or clearing out of the way/hard to reach spawners, places where players wouldn't go normally. If they want the good stuff, they have to earn it.
my style of loot (in my current project specifically) influences exploration... It's simple- harder u work --> better the reward. I miss the days where ctm's had real loot... Not kamyu's chest filler with a bunch of different tiers. i enjoyed it during inferno mines, but i didn't like how popular it became, for me it took out a big chunk of ctm enjoyment. fortunately, it appears as if this kind of loot system is frowned upon more often that not, which i am very pleased with
i love it when loot feels rewarding (Who doesn't?), random loot is the opposite, and really, it chews away at my motivation to keep pushing forward. If the chests are unique, different, unpredictable and useful... it adds exploration and surprise. it does take more time to do it this way, but in my opinion, its completely worth it!
not sure how i feel about different colored lure text for different levels of quality, it's a good system, but i personally wouldn't put that in a map. The only time i use colored lure text is for an extremely rare item, or maybe the"zistonean battlesign" of the map
(i most likely spelled zistonean wrong, cry about it )
Thats more like it
http://www.minecraft...red-emblem-ctm/
http://www.minecraft...red-emblem-ctm/
This is pretty strange.
I didn't know that either. Laingral is downloaded by 5K frances and 1K others. Kind of insane.
It's basically a CTM with a greater emphasis on puzzles, custom enemies, and special items. Oh wait...
Anyways, the primary goal isn't wool collections so it doesn't technically fit the category, but like I said, it plays similarly.
I'd appreciate it if someone would check it out and tell me how I can improve it.
Currently, I've only worked on level design; it doesn't have spawners, items, or monsters yet.
Thanks a bajillion!
On an entirely different note, if you guys are interested in custom mobs this is a good source: http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-discussion/creative-mode/368564-blocky-discovery-space-update-now-with
The OP doesn't have many that would fit well with CTM, but if you look through the pages lots of other people have posted their own customs mobs.
Stuff like the Bomb Chicken or the Kreepen.
Be warned, some of these mobs depended on invisible mobs, which can get wonky when there mount (or rider) dies.
Well that wasn't what i intended, I was trying to define it as a certain item will be found often, like a Level 1 Battle Minecart is something that would be common and pretty much in 1/3 chests you find, something Mythical would be in like 1/50 chests in the whole of intersection 5, i meant it more of a rarity but as you go to higher intersections common loot dissapeared and is replaced by higher tier loot, not that it's only found in that intersection, like a Common item would not show up in intersection 4, the lowest rarity would be a rare/uncommon item.. should have clarified this
See above response.
i was intending that like a Common item will have weak enchants and no attributes. something like a Rare item would have at max 3 enchants and 2 Attributes, yet a Mythical item would be like so.
Mjölnir, The Hammer[/header] Sharp IV
Smite II
Bane III
KB III
Unbr X
Attributes
-5% Speed
+0.9 KB resist
+5 Attack damage (iron axe)
+6 Max Health
that would be a Mythical item as it has 5 enchants and 4 attributes, it's more relative to power levels than rarity, if that makes sense
Hi and welcome, glad to see a new face here. Always good to see new mapmakers, and you seem to know command blocks already, great!
"Currently, I've only worked on level design; it doesn't have spawners, items, or monsters yet."
This sounds really controversial to me? Level design is about, well, designing the level, right? How much of a level is there if there's nothing to do?
I'm picking this out because it's a mistake I see so many (newer) CTM mapmakers make, and I want to try help you get over it quickly. See, a map stands or fails with its gameplay, aesthetics are mostly needed for getting peoples attention in the first place. And if you make a level, without knowing what spawner or loot goes where, you lose 80% of the gameplay already. Gameplay isn't about the type of mob, or about the OPness of a sword in a chest. It's about how the environment is setup, how the player will go through an area. This is true for an area that takes 2 hours to complete, but also for half a ledge in a small room inside that area.
Actually when I meant level design, I meant gameplay. I want the aesthetics to be nice yet, but I'm actually more concerned with how the level plays out. I don't have the spawners and loot in because I want to finish the dungeon before I start working out what the appropriate balance is. However, do have the locations marked out with signs. I know where I want things, I just haven't worked out how much or what. And thanks a ton for responding!
That's actually good. Marking stuff can work too, but remember to eventually stop planning and run a test to see if stuff works out the way you hoped. It's so easy to just keep mapping then to realize that it didn't work out ;-)
That doesn't seem particularly well designed to me. It doesn't leave you any space to create special and good items in early intersections, and really your system only serves to tell you which intersection you got it at. That seems almost useless to me. Why bother to call them "Common", "Uncommon", ect as if it's a rarity list, when it's not that at all?
Community Question:
What do you think loot systems should do in a CTM map? Why do you use your loot system? What is your favorite loot system?
(Yes, it's more than one question technially. Deal with it )
hmm I see your point, I will change it up before I use it... giving them a name like "Bad Item" doesn't really fit.... I could go with [Battle Scarred Item], {Slightly Worn Item] [Freshly Smithed] , [Masterly Smithed Item] and [Heavenly Smithed Item] would that make more sense? the higher the intersection the more effort that was put into it by the forger?
No, I don't think so. I think loot is more there to reward the player for what they've accomplished. This can be a reward for finding a secret, beating a dungeon, or just exploring the other room that had no objective in it. If you look at it that way, loot doesn't have to be useful all the time. In fact, it doese't have to have any use at all, if it's cool in itself. Giving the player something fun can be good too, or something that is just cool too look add.
With this, loot also regulates the tools the player has at their disposal. Most of your tools come from loot, and so you can use loot to give the player access to different strategies of clearing areas. Not all loot are supplies. It can be a stack of tnt that's only good for that specific area, or a water bucket, a key to a door somewhere, or a utility item. Setting every chest up the same way makes loot just one big "supply" number that the mapmaker regulates.
@redstone why bother naming stuff between intersections? It's not 100% necessary to even increase the quality of the loot, since if you increase mob quality as well that doese't really do much. But if you want better loot, you could just make it better without giving it another name? Numbers are numbers, gameplay is gameplay. Those are 2 completely different things.
i like loot systems, it gives more of a RPG, story driven feel, which is well sone in maps like Simulation Protocall II and RageCraft II: Insomnia, I am indecisive right now, waiting from feedback form Fang, my favorite loot system is from SP II: Overload, it's so well done
Basically, if you want loot tiers, make loot tiers. Common items would be your basic tier items for your zone. Early game? That could mean wood. Late, that could mean Iron gear. Let your loot tiers adjust naturally over the course of your map.
In Septum, for example, I have a few tiers and types of available. I've got my normal colored tiers of loot, and then some unique and special items on different tiers. I also do sort items by areas, to make life easier for me as a whole, however, the "Basic", "Common", ect tiers evolve as the map progresses, where, as I mentioned above, what those Common items are get higher tier, being better than what a "Mythic" item could have been back at the first set of areas.
I'm with Rubisk, Loot's a reward. I prefer to only give the bare minimum loot for free. Everything else has to be earned. Secret rooms or clearing out of the way/hard to reach spawners, places where players wouldn't go normally. If they want the good stuff, they have to earn it.
i love it when loot feels rewarding (Who doesn't?), random loot is the opposite, and really, it chews away at my motivation to keep pushing forward. If the chests are unique, different, unpredictable and useful... it adds exploration and surprise. it does take more time to do it this way, but in my opinion, its completely worth it!
not sure how i feel about different colored lure text for different levels of quality, it's a good system, but i personally wouldn't put that in a map. The only time i use colored lure text is for an extremely rare item, or maybe the"zistonean battlesign" of the map
(i most likely spelled zistonean wrong, cry about it )
http://www.minecraft...red-emblem-ctm/
Community question #2 What is the worst CTM map you ever played?
In my opinion:
1 The Painter
2 Hmm...I'm think...Black Desert II.