Well, I've been playing around with the new Anvil, and here's one interesting feature...
you can combine like enchantments to create a greater enchantment!
Two Level I enchants will yield a level II enchant.
Two Level II enchants will yield a level III enchant.
And you guessed it, Two Level III enchants will yield a level IV enchant.
The cost, however, is rather high...
For Efficiency, combining two level I enchants costs 4 levels.
Combining two Level II enchants costs 7 levels
Combining three Level III enchants costs 11 levels.
Unbreaking cost 7 levels to combine two Unbreaking I enchants. I'm willing to bet that the cost varies for other enchants as well.
Notice that if you make an Efficiency IV tool by combining lesser level enchantments. The cost of this is 8 levels for 8 Efficiency I tools, 16 levels to combine 8 E1 tools into 4 E2 tools, 28 levels to combine 4 E2 tools into 2 E3 tools, and finally 11 levels to combine 2 E3 into a single E4. This is a total cost of 63 levels, so as a tool for custom enchantments, this is rather expensive.
But if you've got a bunch of lesser enchantments, after you've used up most of the item, you at least can get a better one by combining them.
I dont know, im quite annoyed with it now. It wont let me name some items. I have a Gold Helmet i crafted in survival that has Aqua Affinity, Respiration and Protection on it and when i stick it in the anvil it wont let me name it. I tried naming another gold helmet and it worked fine. Its definitely got some bugs.
Yeah, although i love how we don't have to throw away our damaged tools, and we can drop anvils on mob's heads, why does Jeb expect us to have all these levels? I mean, come on Jeb! For three or four repairs you'll have to kill a ender dragon!!! It's crazy!
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"If I can't be the best, I sure as hell can be the worst." - Jon Jafari
Yeah, although i love how we don't have to throw away our damaged tools, and we can drop anvils on mob's heads, why does Jeb expect us to have all these levels? I mean, come on Jeb! For three or four repairs you'll have to kill a ender dragon!!! It's crazy!
I have a few complaints with the anvil repair. It has some pretty stupid limitations which significantly impairs its usefulness and have been added for no reason that I can see.
First of all, the most limiting thing is that you cannot repair/combine items if the cost of doing so exceeds 40 levels. This means that combining 2 powerful items becomes impossible, even if you have the levels required. If the player works hard to get those levels, shouldn't he be able to spend as many as he pleases?
Renaming a tool costs 15 levels. 15 whole levels! I can understand it costing maybe one or two levels, but 15 is pretty ridiculous. This also means that it is impossible to rename powerful tools, because attempting to do so will push you over the 40 level cap. Also, renaming a tool more than once costs more than 15 levels, increasing by 150% each time according to the wiki.
Also, repairing the same tool more than once will increase the cost of repairing that tool each time, even if you are just repairing you tool with a normal unenchanted tool of the same type each time. This means that you cannot keep your super-powerful pickaxe and keep repairing it because eventually it will become too expensive to be possible. I don't think this should be a limitation. Powerful tools should be expensive to repair, but their expense should not go up every time, that doesn't seem fair.
Also, why does the anvil break? It already costs levels to use, why do we have to spend 55 iron ingots to get ourselves a new anvil every so often? It's the only block that has this limitation, and I don't understand why it does.
Things, I am happy about though are the fact we can do this at all, the fact that combining enchantments of the same level increases the level, the repair cost takes the rarity and power of the enchantment into account, that you can rename any items (even if it does cost 5 levels for a non tool item) and that you can drop anvils on people and squash them.
So, overall, I like the addition of the anvil, but it needs some work. I would be satisfied with only the level cap being removed, though I would like all my issues with it to be fixed.
why does Jeb expect us to have all these levels? I mean, come on Jeb! For three or four repairs you'll have to kill a ender dragon!!! It's crazy!
Jeb didn't make the anvil. Even without a mob farm with the changes to XP it usually only takes maybe a night out killing mobs to get to lvl 30. (Not to mention mining and now breeding giving you experience)
I have a few complaints with the anvil repair. It has some pretty stupid limitations which significantly impairs its usefulness and have been added for no reason that I can see.
First of all, the most limiting thing is that you cannot repair/combine items if the cost of doing so exceeds 40 levels. This means that combining 2 powerful items becomes impossible, even if you have the levels required. If the player works hard to get those levels, shouldn't he be able to spend as many as he pleases?
Renaming a tool costs 15 levels. 15 whole levels! I can understand it costing maybe one or two levels, but 15 is pretty ridiculous. This also means that it is impossible to rename powerful tools, because attempting to do so will push you over the 40 level cap. Also, renaming a tool more than once costs more than 15 levels, increasing by 150% each time according to the wiki.
Also, repairing the same tool more than once will increase the cost of repairing that tool each time, even if you are just repairing you tool with a normal unenchanted tool of the same type each time. This means that you cannot keep your super-powerful pickaxe and keep repairing it because eventually it will become too expensive to be possible. I don't think this should be a limitation. Powerful tools should be expensive to repair, but their expense should not go up every time, that doesn't seem fair.
Also, why does the anvil break? It already costs levels to use, why do we have to spend 55 iron ingots to get ourselves a new anvil every so often? It's the only block that has this limitation, and I don't understand why it does.
Things, I am happy about though are the fact we can do this at all, the fact that combining enchantments of the same level increases the level, the repair cost takes the rarity and power of the enchantment into account, that you can rename any items (even if it does cost 5 levels for a non tool item) and that you can drop anvils on people and squash them.
So, overall, I like the addition of the anvil, but it needs some work. I would be satisfied with only the level cap being removed, though I would like all my issues with it to be fixed.
I was so excited for this snapshot that I wanted to update my server with it, and I hate using a snapshot on my server but I've been looking forward to this feature for a while. Anyway... I loaded a copy of my server I had and tried to repair the tools I had stashed away because they were about to break and to my horror they are all unrepairable because they are past the level cap already. They were not even that good of swords. Each with sharpness and one with looting the other had fire aspect. I can repair them with a new unenchanted sword but I naming them puts them past the cap. I wanted to combine then repair and name but being level 42 just to combine the two it is impossible.
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Playing Minecraft since [Friday, March 19, 2010, 9:20:21 PM] (First indev world save)
Yeah, maybe the level requirements are a little too much. But we can be glad that it's just a snapshot, and nothing is set in stone.
We are testing it exactly to see if it is balanced. All that we must do is bring this to Dinnerbone's attention.
1. Its to prevent people creating the best gear and use it forever.
But isn't that the point? It's like false hope. If they want to limit the gear then just make the system limited to only combinations that are possible on the enchantment probabilities table and let us repair items as long as we like. It still costs quite a bit of XP and an item of the same type.
I think the strangest thing is not being able to rename powerful enchanted items, because those are the only ones worth renaming. I also dislike the repair level limit, it really restricts what's possible with the anvil.
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"Can't very well use magic when your wand is out of bullets." - Homestuck
“If, by some strange coincidence, a hundred sharp pencils I was carrying embedded themselves in a third-party, would that be an accidental death?” - Nisemonogatari
I think the strangest thing is not being able to rename powerful enchanted items, because those are the only ones worth renaming. I also dislike the repair level limit, it really restricts what's possible with the anvil.
It's basically useless. The only items worth repairing are the ones you CAN'T repair. Sure you can throw a few low level enchantments together to get a better one but that item to will become un-repairable too. I really don't understand the point of adding a repair system that cannot even repair anything worth while. Who actually cares if we are able to craft up to the max enchanted items? It will take a lot of resources and levels to do so and is not game breaking because you can get lucky initial enchantments for much cheaper. Hell I would rather have the ability to indefinitely repair my favorite sword then this useless limited ability to combine enchantments. At least then when you do get lucky and get something good you can keep it. Right now you are still forced to roll the dice every time your high level tools break because the repair system CAN'T repair them.
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Playing Minecraft since [Friday, March 19, 2010, 9:20:21 PM] (First indev world save)
I think the strangest thing is not being able to rename powerful enchanted items, because those are the only ones worth renaming. I also dislike the repair level limit, it really restricts what's possible with the anvil.
I'm angered by this. On a server, I got a bow with Power IV, Punch II, Flame I, and Infinity I straight out of the enchantment table. Then I tried for a regular Power IV bow. I combined them in an anvil, and figured out i could make the best bow in the game. The only problem is I CAN'T EVEN NAME IT. If I attempt changing the letters, it says it is "Too Expensive!".
I only hope that this is fixed, there shouldn't be a limit there when trying to name the item.
You can still make the best items, you just cant repair those. And lets face it, thats a good thing. Otherwise its just a matter of time before everyone has the best gear and be able to use it forever. Is that realy fun? And from a designers POV, how do you balance new features? With everyone using these powerfull items in mind? As a player id sure love to have the best gear. Being able to use it forever would be even more awesome. But is that realy balanced?
What's not balanced is that it allows a player to unlimitely repair the second best item, which is not that much weaker, but make a mistake and get your prized item too high and you just have to watch it go bye bye. Thats what most people don't like. The system should be 'idiot proof'. It should set the line and not let you cross it, instead of penalizing you if you do. That's what most people are unhappy with, well that and the fact that naming your item actually means it will be weaker to stay under the limit.
What's not balanced is that it allows a player to unlimitely repair the second best item, which is not that much weaker, but make a mistake and get your prized item too high and you just have to watch it go bye bye. Thats what most people don't like. The system should be 'idiot proof'. It should set the line and not let you cross it, instead of penalizing you if you do. That's what most people are unhappy with, well that and the fact that naming your item actually means it will be weaker to stay under the limit.
Why on earth do you think a game should be "idiot proof?" Any game where you can't fail is boring IMO, and there's little enough room for failure in vanilla Minecraft as it is, once you've gotten beyond the initial stages of development.
Why on earth do you think a game should be "idiot proof?" Any game where you can't fail is boring IMO, and there's little enough room for failure in vanilla Minecraft as it is, once you've gotten beyond the initial stages of development.
In this particular situation people don't like to be penalized for something they didn't know and then once they do know, having to micro manage the situation just to avoid it from happening. That isn't fun nor challenging. They should be able to use the anvil with peace of mind and have a positive experience from a feature that is supposed to be positive. It's already expensive, why add a hassle to using it?
A failures system in a game would need to be negative events that are beyond the players control. Otherwise players would just avoid what they can control and then at a certain point it just becomes tedium. For example add potions having a small chance to have a negative effect instead of the intended one. Or add truly negative enchantments to the enchantment system. Or give mobs a chance to critical hit. Things that actually give the players a chance for failure but through intended ways beyond the players control.
Yeah, although i love how we don't have to throw away our damaged tools, and we can drop anvils on mob's heads, why does Jeb expect us to have all these levels? I mean, come on Jeb! For three or four repairs you'll have to kill a ender dragon!!! It's crazy!
Go to the End, and make a small, well-lit box. Make sure that you can see out of it and that Enderman can see in. **** off as many Enderman as you can from said box, then kill 'em all as they surround your box, unable to attack you while you can still hit them with a sword or bow (I'd suggest a sword, since it's gonna be close-quarters combat). You can put a door there too so you can go outside and get all of the delicious orbs of XP that float around this box.
Go to the End, and make a small, well-lit box. Make sure that you can see out of it and that Enderman can see in. **** off as many Enderman as you can from said box, then kill 'em all as they surround your box, unable to attack you while you can still hit them with a sword or bow (I'd suggest a sword, since it's gonna be close-quarters combat). You can put a door there too so you can go outside and get all of the delicious orbs of XP that float around this box.
Then go home and repair stuff.
As much as I think the anvil is fine the way it is (minus bugs) I think that the example you gave is a bad one, considering not everyone has access to the End, nor do they want to grind experience.
Of the anvil? No. Allowing you to keep a single item forever essentially means the enchantment table only exists until you get the "best gear", and then you never use it again. Allowing the Anvil to work on the same tool infinitely makes further use of the Enchanting table irrelevant.
It's like false hope. If they want to limit the gear then just make the system limited to only combinations that are possible on the enchantment probabilities table and let us repair items as long as we like. It still costs quite a bit of XP and an item of the same type.
By limiting what you can repair, and how many times you repair it. It allows people that don't use mob farms to make the same use of the thing as the people that do use mob farms. By giving it infinite uses, it's balance is against the lazy infinity of mob farms, validating- and arguably requiring- their use.
you can combine like enchantments to create a greater enchantment!
Two Level I enchants will yield a level II enchant.
Two Level II enchants will yield a level III enchant.
And you guessed it, Two Level III enchants will yield a level IV enchant.
The cost, however, is rather high...
For Efficiency, combining two level I enchants costs 4 levels.
Combining two Level II enchants costs 7 levels
Combining three Level III enchants costs 11 levels.
Unbreaking cost 7 levels to combine two Unbreaking I enchants. I'm willing to bet that the cost varies for other enchants as well.
Notice that if you make an Efficiency IV tool by combining lesser level enchantments. The cost of this is 8 levels for 8 Efficiency I tools, 16 levels to combine 8 E1 tools into 4 E2 tools, 28 levels to combine 4 E2 tools into 2 E3 tools, and finally 11 levels to combine 2 E3 into a single E4. This is a total cost of 63 levels, so as a tool for custom enchantments, this is rather expensive.
But if you've got a bunch of lesser enchantments, after you've used up most of the item, you at least can get a better one by combining them.
"If I can't be the best, I sure as hell can be the worst." - Jon Jafari
I propose to you, the Ender Ender.
And your problem is solved.
Even without a farm you can get okay exp killing blazes or with pumpkin on head and a good sword killing endermen in the end the regular way.
First of all, the most limiting thing is that you cannot repair/combine items if the cost of doing so exceeds 40 levels. This means that combining 2 powerful items becomes impossible, even if you have the levels required. If the player works hard to get those levels, shouldn't he be able to spend as many as he pleases?
Renaming a tool costs 15 levels. 15 whole levels! I can understand it costing maybe one or two levels, but 15 is pretty ridiculous. This also means that it is impossible to rename powerful tools, because attempting to do so will push you over the 40 level cap. Also, renaming a tool more than once costs more than 15 levels, increasing by 150% each time according to the wiki.
Also, repairing the same tool more than once will increase the cost of repairing that tool each time, even if you are just repairing you tool with a normal unenchanted tool of the same type each time. This means that you cannot keep your super-powerful pickaxe and keep repairing it because eventually it will become too expensive to be possible. I don't think this should be a limitation. Powerful tools should be expensive to repair, but their expense should not go up every time, that doesn't seem fair.
Also, why does the anvil break? It already costs levels to use, why do we have to spend 55 iron ingots to get ourselves a new anvil every so often? It's the only block that has this limitation, and I don't understand why it does.
Things, I am happy about though are the fact we can do this at all, the fact that combining enchantments of the same level increases the level, the repair cost takes the rarity and power of the enchantment into account, that you can rename any items (even if it does cost 5 levels for a non tool item) and that you can drop anvils on people and squash them.
So, overall, I like the addition of the anvil, but it needs some work. I would be satisfied with only the level cap being removed, though I would like all my issues with it to be fixed.
Jeb didn't make the anvil. Even without a mob farm with the changes to XP it usually only takes maybe a night out killing mobs to get to lvl 30. (Not to mention mining and now breeding giving you experience)
I was so excited for this snapshot that I wanted to update my server with it, and I hate using a snapshot on my server but I've been looking forward to this feature for a while. Anyway... I loaded a copy of my server I had and tried to repair the tools I had stashed away because they were about to break and to my horror they are all unrepairable because they are past the level cap already. They were not even that good of swords. Each with sharpness and one with looting the other had fire aspect. I can repair them with a new unenchanted sword but I naming them puts them past the cap. I wanted to combine then repair and name but being level 42 just to combine the two it is impossible.
Playing Minecraft since [Friday, March 19, 2010, 9:20:21 PM] (First indev world save)
We are testing it exactly to see if it is balanced. All that we must do is bring this to Dinnerbone's attention.
That's what it means to be a leader. You take a lot of crap, but you also get a lot of the credit when things go well.
But isn't that the point? It's like false hope. If they want to limit the gear then just make the system limited to only combinations that are possible on the enchantment probabilities table and let us repair items as long as we like. It still costs quite a bit of XP and an item of the same type.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
“If, by some strange coincidence, a hundred sharp pencils I was carrying embedded themselves in a third-party, would that be an accidental death?” - Nisemonogatari
It's basically useless. The only items worth repairing are the ones you CAN'T repair. Sure you can throw a few low level enchantments together to get a better one but that item to will become un-repairable too. I really don't understand the point of adding a repair system that cannot even repair anything worth while. Who actually cares if we are able to craft up to the max enchanted items? It will take a lot of resources and levels to do so and is not game breaking because you can get lucky initial enchantments for much cheaper. Hell I would rather have the ability to indefinitely repair my favorite sword then this useless limited ability to combine enchantments. At least then when you do get lucky and get something good you can keep it. Right now you are still forced to roll the dice every time your high level tools break because the repair system CAN'T repair them.
Playing Minecraft since [Friday, March 19, 2010, 9:20:21 PM] (First indev world save)
I only hope that this is fixed, there shouldn't be a limit there when trying to name the item.
What's not balanced is that it allows a player to unlimitely repair the second best item, which is not that much weaker, but make a mistake and get your prized item too high and you just have to watch it go bye bye. Thats what most people don't like. The system should be 'idiot proof'. It should set the line and not let you cross it, instead of penalizing you if you do. That's what most people are unhappy with, well that and the fact that naming your item actually means it will be weaker to stay under the limit.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
Why on earth do you think a game should be "idiot proof?" Any game where you can't fail is boring IMO, and there's little enough room for failure in vanilla Minecraft as it is, once you've gotten beyond the initial stages of development.
In this particular situation people don't like to be penalized for something they didn't know and then once they do know, having to micro manage the situation just to avoid it from happening. That isn't fun nor challenging. They should be able to use the anvil with peace of mind and have a positive experience from a feature that is supposed to be positive. It's already expensive, why add a hassle to using it?
A failures system in a game would need to be negative events that are beyond the players control. Otherwise players would just avoid what they can control and then at a certain point it just becomes tedium. For example add potions having a small chance to have a negative effect instead of the intended one. Or add truly negative enchantments to the enchantment system. Or give mobs a chance to critical hit. Things that actually give the players a chance for failure but through intended ways beyond the players control.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
Go to the End, and make a small, well-lit box. Make sure that you can see out of it and that Enderman can see in. **** off as many Enderman as you can from said box, then kill 'em all as they surround your box, unable to attack you while you can still hit them with a sword or bow (I'd suggest a sword, since it's gonna be close-quarters combat). You can put a door there too so you can go outside and get all of the delicious orbs of XP that float around this box.
Then go home and repair stuff.
As much as I think the anvil is fine the way it is (minus bugs) I think that the example you gave is a bad one, considering not everyone has access to the End, nor do they want to grind experience.
...but that's just like, my opinion, man.
By limiting what you can repair, and how many times you repair it. It allows people that don't use mob farms to make the same use of the thing as the people that do use mob farms. By giving it infinite uses, it's balance is against the lazy infinity of mob farms, validating- and arguably requiring- their use.