So, we know that there is going to be a new source of permanent light in the game, as well as blocks in hell that don't go out once lit on fire...
Am I the only one who sees this?! I mean, Notch even said that there's no new recipes so far too, so the chance the the new hell blocks (which are as rare as dirt there) are what you use as 'lanterns' seems likely to me.
You should be able to hold lanterns and have them light your immediate area up, IMO.
i agree. i think that is a good idea. if u make a lantern it should light up your area without having to place it down. =D
I had thought about that. Makes sense, but you have to switch to a sword when you want to fight better, thus the light goes out.
[rant]
I find it funny how so many people are suggesting such easy recipes for lanterns. First off, Torches are so ungodly easy to make, that one could have have 64 after day one, which is usually spent finding a cave and the coal, usually in the same area. And that's just sixteen pieces of coal.
Lanterns last forever. That alone makes them better then torches, will have a finite duration, but can be relit just by using a flint and steel(which last a long time). Why should something that's much better be only slightly tougher to make? The risk for making them logically would be high.
Which is why I think that the lantern will need not coal, not wood, not oil or kerosene, but something that is risky to get.
And notch said that the blood red blocks in hell burn forever. Anyone who caught that bit, and passed a int/wis check would guess that he didn't just mention it just to add to the article. Same logic as Chekov's Gun. If it's mentioned at all, it thus is important.
[/rant]
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
IMO lanterns should be made like this:
[] []
[] [] = 24 lanterns
[] []
= Bloody/Red moss cobblestone that burns forever when ignited and is found everywhere in hell.
Lanterns could be placed on ceilings too, and underwater, would emit the strongest lighting possible (the same as the sun).
And torches should last 1 entire day (20 minutes) before needing to be ignited again.
Also, obsidian should be made realistic in this update, so it would break fast istead of slowly, and would drop even if you break it with your hand. And bricks would be the new hardest material, they wouldn't be as hard as obsidian is now, but a block of brick wouldn't be destryoed by a single explosion, it would need atleast 2 explosions very near to break it, it would need a steel pickaxe to get a drop of it, it should take around 30 seconds to break it with hands, 9 seconds with steel pickaxe, and 6 seconds to break it with diamond pickaxe, and the clay should be way way more common too, so it wouldn't be so hard to make bricks. It is very likely that everything won't work like I said tho
IMO lanterns should be made like this:
[] []
[] [] = 24 lanterns
[] []
= Bloody/Red moss cobblestone that burns forever when ignited and is found everywhere in hell.
Lanterns could be placed on ceilings too, and underwater, would emit the strongest lighting possible (the same as the sun).
And torches should last 1 entire day (20 minutes) before needing to be ignited again.
Also, obsidian should be made realistic in this update, so it would break fast istead of slowly, and would drop even if you break it with your hand. And bricks would be the new hardest material, they wouldn't be as hard as obsidian is now, but a block of brick wouldn't be destryoed by a single explosion, it would need atleast 2 explosions very near to break it, it would need a steel pickaxe to get a drop of it, it should take around 30 seconds to break it with hands, 9 seconds with steel pickaxe, and 6 seconds to break it with diamond pickaxe, and
the clay should be way way more common too, so it wouldn't be so hard to make bricks. It is very likely that everything won't work like I said tho
I agree with the stuff before the creepers(which I added to divide the post). Obsidian isn't exactly something one could break with their bare hands, even less so if it has just formed. First off, it's sharp. A obsidian blade could cut a horse's head clean off. Not the sort of thing one decides to punch until it breaks. Well, someone who passed a DC 5 int check, anyway.
Second, it's reaches 5 on the Mohs scale. Talc, which can be broken by hand with ease, scores 1. Above that, closer to 5 is Apatite, which is a major component both in tooth enamel and in our bones. Not easy to break by hand, are they?
Plus, this is fresh volcanic glass. Anyone stupid enough to try and break it by hand should take damage each swing they make. From burning themselves.
EDIT: OK, put some sheep in to show the next part I agree with(it follows after the sheep)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
There are so many pros and cons to the whole torch business...
I can think of nothing more amusing than coming home form a hard day's work in the mines, to then open my bedroom door and see this staring at me.
On the other hand, I can think of nothing more aggravating than coming home form a hard day's work in the mines, to then open my treasure hoard door and see this staring at-SSSSSSSHHH BOOOOM!!!!
Then there is the whole balance of how long do torches last (I'm hoping for 3 days), can they be relight, and will they dim a bit when they are starting to fail (on day 3), so we know when to replace them so that these don't appear in our homes to !@#$ our stuff.
Either way, I assume this will make Lava a more prominent tool for lighting our bases, until we get the lanterns....Which I hope don't require "hell blocks" to make. Obsidian appears to be ridiculously hard to get as is. Then again....Once you DO get obsidian...I guess it should be safe enough to just run into hell, grab a block or two and then run like hell to light up your base with lanterns.
I know Notch is essentially a genius, but I really hope he get's the balance on this right. Light seems to be a really important part of minecraft, since anywhere dark can spawn monsters.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Enjoy written Let's Plays? My blog for them is right here:
IMO lanterns should be made like this:
[] []
[] [] = 24 lanterns
[] []
= Bloody/Red moss cobblestone that burns forever when ignited and is found everywhere in hell.
Lanterns could be placed on ceilings too, and underwater, would emit the strongest lighting possible (the same as the sun).
And torches should last 1 entire day (20 minutes) before needing to be ignited again.
Also, obsidian should be made realistic in this update, so it would break fast istead of slowly, and would drop even if you break it with your hand. And bricks would be the new hardest material, they wouldn't be as hard as obsidian is now, but a block of brick wouldn't be destryoed by a single explosion, it would need atleast 2 explosions very near to break it, it would need a steel pickaxe to get a drop of it, it should take around 30 seconds to break it with hands, 9 seconds with steel pickaxe, and 6 seconds to break it with diamond pickaxe, and
the clay should be way way more common too, so it wouldn't be so hard to make bricks. It is very likely that everything won't work like I said tho
I agree with the stuff before the creepers(which I added to divide the post). Obsidian isn't exactly something one could break with their bare hands, even less so if it has just formed. First off, it's sharp. A obsidian blade could cut a horse's head clean off. Not the sort of thing one decides to punch until it breaks. Well, someone who passed a DC 5 int check, anyway.
Second, it's reaches 5 on the Mohs scale. Talc, which can be broken by hand with ease, scores 1. Above that, closer to 5 is Apatite, which is a major component both in tooth enamel and in our bones. Not easy to break by hand, are they?
Plus, this is fresh volcanic glass. Anyone stupid enough to try and break it by hand should take damage each swing they make. From burning themselves.
EDIT: OK, put some sheep in to show the next part I agree with(it follows after the sheep)
It doesn't need to be so realistic to the point it will cause heat damage... Also, glass is 7 in the mohs scale, yet it is very fragile, and in Minecraft too, we break it easily with our hands, and we also punch trees, it doesn't need to be super-realistic because it just doesn't work in minecraft, it just need to have the basics of realism, so it can be very fragile and break simply by using hands with no problem.
i think lanterns shouldn't be hard to make, because it would just be irritating if you wanted to have a large base. and not being able to permanently light your base for a while would be the most frustrating thing in the world. half the time, you'd just be running around your base relighting torches mumbling curses under your breath.
maybe there should be a mode of the game where lanterns are tougher to make, for all the people who want the game super hard. tough aspects would be a nice challenge sometimes, but i don't want something like it for all my worlds, and for it to forced on me, as it kind of limits what you can do and build
It doesn't need to be so realistic to the point it will cause heat damage... Also, glass is 7 in the mohs scale, yet it is very fragile, and in Minecraft too, we break it easily with our hands, and we also punch trees, it doesn't need to be super-realistic because it just doesn't work in minecraft, it just need to have the basics of realism, so it can be very fragile and break simply by using hands with no problem.
Oh, I know that realism is not my dish. I'm just saying that Obsidian is damn near impossible to break safely with your bare hands.
Plus, if Obsidian is easy to harvest, it is thus easy to enter hell, which thus makes the risk vs reward on hell raiding for firestone unbalanced. It shouldn't be easy to enter hell. Partially because it's a magic realm where time and space are altered(seeing as you can move one square and be sixteen squares away in the real world).
Hell is already going to be tougher then anywhere on the normal map, save the void(which isn't really part of the map, since it's the part where you leave the map completely, only to die very quickly because it's a endless fall, which makes it hard to respawn because you can't die without the death effect since nothing is there). I don't think that anything that would make entry easier would make sense if one wants the risk vs reward to be worth it.
Not that the risk is currently worth the reward, unless the teleportation and firestone is worth enough to someone.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
I agree with Dvsilverwing about holding lanterns so then you can hold it and see whats around you and you dont have to place it anywhere and i think to make lanterns it should be like this
[] []
[] []
[] []
or like this
[] []
[] []
[] []
yea like that
Having to go to hell for lantern materials would SUCK. IMHO, I think making a stupid lantern should be easier than finding lava and diamond and mining obsidian, then risking having your house blown up by fireball spitting giant jellyfish.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Please learn how to use google. My grandfather knows how to, I think you can too.
kinda hoping it requires redstone. i like the idea of having other uses for redstone for those of us who can't be bothered learning the logic gate stuff.
Somebody else in this topic mentioned it, but I think that Notch should make redstone dust work on all surfaces and have the lanterns run off of them. Imagine a stone corridor deep under the earth, and there are red lanterns every 5 meters, with a line of redstone stringing them together (lanterns act like double NOT gates, extending the redstone current range).
As for lanterns, they should be glass cubes with a red glow emanating from them, more like an LED than a lantern.
A long list of replies since I've been busy all day:
1. There will never be a mobile source of light, due to how long it takes to recalculate lighting at such a scale. If you see the sun rise in the morning, you will see gradual waves of light fall across the landscape, not just one big switch being flicked. A mobile source of light could also be very choppy if you attempt to avoid the previous problem by making it simply spawn and despawn invisible torches every block, not to mention the lag this wold create with several people in multiplayer.
2. Obsidian and brick are just about fine as is, my only qualm with brick is the difficulty (read: impossibility) to find it on snow levels due to it being covered by snow.
3. You don't need to get obsidian, you can pick up the lava with a bucket, place it into a mold (four dirt blocks surrounding a one block area where you want to create the obsidian), then place water on top of the nearby dirt block, flowing onto the lava and turning it to obsidian.
4. Crafting differences based on difficulty will not carry over to multiplayer well, simply because resource management can be hard to adjust to a lot more than taking a little more or less damage. That said, a 'creative' difficulty will be eventually added, perhaps with infinite light constantly.
5. Redstone is used as an option, not a necessity in games, hence why its uses are creating complicated structures you can do without and a compass which points to spawn, which might not even be of use to you, and why it takes so long to mine. All this is to add an extra layer to the game that you don't have to explore.
6. Glass shouldn't be used in lanterns, in my opinion, simply because having them largely dependant on glass, thus sand, thus on how close you built to a beach seems sort of dodgy in my opinion, as those awesome mountain-top bases will become a lot less awesome if bathed in darkness due to being 20 minutes from the nearest sandy beach.
i think that torches running out will make the game more realistic, but it will take away a big part of the game. i mean, who hasnt gone in a cave with torches? when you find that same cave again, you know youve been there before. not so if they run out. i think that the torches should stay the same
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I am Rico, and I approve this message
GENERATION 18: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment
(__/) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your
(='.'=) signature to gain world domination!
ON: I just hope Notch's would keep that stuff with torches running out. What about to make just on lantern as a gear and when you hold it in your hand it automaticly generates light when you are walking in a cavern.
Quote from Alfa »
A long list of replies since I've been busy all day:
1. There will never be a mobile source of light, due to how long it takes to recalculate lighting at such a scale. If you see the sun rise in the morning, you will see gradual waves of light fall across the landscape, not just one big switch being flicked. A mobile source of light could also be very choppy if you attempt to avoid the previous problem by making it simply spawn and despawn invisible torches every block, not to mention the lag this wold create with several people in multiplayer.
Quote from RicoVig »
i think that torches running out will make the game more realistic, but it will take away a big part of the game. i mean, who hasnt gone in a cave with torches? when you find that same cave again, you know youve been there before. not so if they run out. i think that the torches should stay the same
There are other ways to block of caves, like placing a straight wall of dirtor cobblestone there, and even then, the old torches will still be on the walls.
I dunno if anyone has bothered to mention this or not on this thread but..
Does anyone have any idea about the timelimit on the torches?
Would it be like a couple of hours or something similar to that of a real torch or?
And remember; its not that easy to obtain Iron on the first night of a new game in Minecraft. From memory you need a piece of Iron as well as obtaining the obvious flint (to which is simple enough to get). Mining iron in the first day can be a little difficult.
Do you think Notch has done something about a simple case like this? Example ~ more iron ore or perhaps bring it a little closer to the surface of the world or entrance to a cave?
I dunno if anyone has bothered to mention this or not on this thread but..
Does anyone have any idea about the timelimit on the torches?
Would it be like a couple of hours or something similar to that of a real torch or?
And remember; its not that easy to obtain Iron on the first night of a new game in Minecraft. From memory you need a piece of Iron as well as obtaining the obvious flint (to which is simple enough to get). Mining iron in the first day can be a little difficult.
Do you think Notch has done something about a simple case like this? Example ~ more iron ore or perhaps bring it a little closer to the surface of the world or entrance to a cave?
Walking around a mountainous area with a good bit of attention payed to your surroundings should net you that one iron needed to begin with. Anyway, ideally, when a torch is placed, it will start of lit, but collecting a placed torch will give you an unlit torch (in a seperate inventory slot), which can then be placed and relit. This would allow you to survive without relighting torches, albeit in an inconvenient and costly manner.
Am I the only one who sees this?! I mean, Notch even said that there's no new recipes so far too, so the chance the the new hell blocks (which are as rare as dirt there) are what you use as 'lanterns' seems likely to me.
Possible lantern recipe
i agree. i think that is a good idea. if u make a lantern it should light up your area without having to place it down. =D
(__/) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your
(='.'=) signature to help him gain world domination!
I had thought about that. Makes sense, but you have to switch to a sword when you want to fight better, thus the light goes out.
[rant]
I find it funny how so many people are suggesting such easy recipes for lanterns. First off, Torches are so ungodly easy to make, that one could have have 64 after day one, which is usually spent finding a cave and the coal, usually in the same area. And that's just sixteen pieces of coal.
Lanterns last forever. That alone makes them better then torches, will have a finite duration, but can be relit just by using a flint and steel(which last a long time). Why should something that's much better be only slightly tougher to make? The risk for making them logically would be high.
Which is why I think that the lantern will need not coal, not wood, not oil or kerosene, but something that is risky to get.
And notch said that the blood red blocks in hell burn forever. Anyone who caught that bit, and passed a int/wis check would guess that he didn't just mention it just to add to the article. Same logic as Chekov's Gun. If it's mentioned at all, it thus is important.
[/rant]
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
[] []
[] [] = 24 lanterns
[] []
= Bloody/Red moss cobblestone that burns forever when ignited and is found everywhere in hell.
Lanterns could be placed on ceilings too, and underwater, would emit the strongest lighting possible (the same as the sun).
And torches should last 1 entire day (20 minutes) before needing to be ignited again.
Also, obsidian should be made realistic in this update, so it would break fast istead of slowly, and would drop even if you break it with your hand. And bricks would be the new hardest material, they wouldn't be as hard as obsidian is now, but a block of brick wouldn't be destryoed by a single explosion, it would need atleast 2 explosions very near to break it, it would need a steel pickaxe to get a drop of it, it should take around 30 seconds to break it with hands, 9 seconds with steel pickaxe, and 6 seconds to break it with diamond pickaxe, and the clay should be way way more common too, so it wouldn't be so hard to make bricks. It is very likely that everything won't work like I said tho
My skin: http://minecraft.net/skin/skin.jsp?user=_L1pE_BR (Anarcho-Communist BLU Heavy Weapons Guy)
I agree with the stuff before the creepers(which I added to divide the post). Obsidian isn't exactly something one could break with their bare hands, even less so if it has just formed. First off, it's sharp. A obsidian blade could cut a horse's head clean off. Not the sort of thing one decides to punch until it breaks. Well, someone who passed a DC 5 int check, anyway.
Second, it's reaches 5 on the Mohs scale. Talc, which can be broken by hand with ease, scores 1. Above that, closer to 5 is Apatite, which is a major component both in tooth enamel and in our bones. Not easy to break by hand, are they?
Plus, this is fresh volcanic glass. Anyone stupid enough to try and break it by hand should take damage each swing they make. From burning themselves.
EDIT: OK, put some sheep in to show the next part I agree with(it follows after the sheep)
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
I can think of nothing more amusing than coming home form a hard day's work in the mines, to then open my bedroom door and see this staring at me.
On the other hand, I can think of nothing more aggravating than coming home form a hard day's work in the mines, to then open my treasure hoard door and see this staring at-SSSSSSSHHH BOOOOM!!!!
Then there is the whole balance of how long do torches last (I'm hoping for 3 days), can they be relight, and will they dim a bit when they are starting to fail (on day 3), so we know when to replace them so that these don't appear in our homes to !@#$ our stuff.
Either way, I assume this will make Lava a more prominent tool for lighting our bases, until we get the lanterns....Which I hope don't require "hell blocks" to make. Obsidian appears to be ridiculously hard to get as is. Then again....Once you DO get obsidian...I guess it should be safe enough to just run into hell, grab a block or two and then run like hell to light up your base with lanterns.
I know Notch is essentially a genius, but I really hope he get's the balance on this right. Light seems to be a really important part of minecraft, since anywhere dark can spawn monsters.
It doesn't need to be so realistic to the point it will cause heat damage... Also, glass is 7 in the mohs scale, yet it is very fragile, and in Minecraft too, we break it easily with our hands, and we also punch trees, it doesn't need to be super-realistic because it just doesn't work in minecraft, it just need to have the basics of realism, so it can be very fragile and break simply by using hands with no problem.
My skin: http://minecraft.net/skin/skin.jsp?user=_L1pE_BR (Anarcho-Communist BLU Heavy Weapons Guy)
i think lanterns shouldn't be hard to make, because it would just be irritating if you wanted to have a large base. and not being able to permanently light your base for a while would be the most frustrating thing in the world. half the time, you'd just be running around your base relighting torches mumbling curses under your breath.
maybe there should be a mode of the game where lanterns are tougher to make, for all the people who want the game super hard. tough aspects would be a nice challenge sometimes, but i don't want something like it for all my worlds, and for it to forced on me, as it kind of limits what you can do and build
Oh, I know that realism is not my dish. I'm just saying that Obsidian is damn near impossible to break safely with your bare hands.
Plus, if Obsidian is easy to harvest, it is thus easy to enter hell, which thus makes the risk vs reward on hell raiding for firestone unbalanced. It shouldn't be easy to enter hell. Partially because it's a magic realm where time and space are altered(seeing as you can move one square and be sixteen squares away in the real world).
Hell is already going to be tougher then anywhere on the normal map, save the void(which isn't really part of the map, since it's the part where you leave the map completely, only to die very quickly because it's a endless fall, which makes it hard to respawn because you can't die without the death effect since nothing is there). I don't think that anything that would make entry easier would make sense if one wants the risk vs reward to be worth it.
Not that the risk is currently worth the reward, unless the teleportation and firestone is worth enough to someone.
"Minecraft is like an orgasm - even science can't describe it"
[quote=Cryptonat][quote=Snitch]Basically you're stuck in hell till you find a portal out. There are alternatives to pig, by the way, as you probably know. :> There are no alternatives to Bacon. Ever.
[] []
[] []
[] []
or like this
[] []
[] []
[] []
yea like that
Just a thought, but perhaps construction of lanterns would require the use of torches?
Say...
= 3 stacked torches
Then...
[] []
[] []
[] []
As for lanterns, they should be glass cubes with a red glow emanating from them, more like an LED than a lantern.
Red = Redstone dust
1. There will never be a mobile source of light, due to how long it takes to recalculate lighting at such a scale. If you see the sun rise in the morning, you will see gradual waves of light fall across the landscape, not just one big switch being flicked. A mobile source of light could also be very choppy if you attempt to avoid the previous problem by making it simply spawn and despawn invisible torches every block, not to mention the lag this wold create with several people in multiplayer.
2. Obsidian and brick are just about fine as is, my only qualm with brick is the difficulty (read: impossibility) to find it on snow levels due to it being covered by snow.
3. You don't need to get obsidian, you can pick up the lava with a bucket, place it into a mold (four dirt blocks surrounding a one block area where you want to create the obsidian), then place water on top of the nearby dirt block, flowing onto the lava and turning it to obsidian.
4. Crafting differences based on difficulty will not carry over to multiplayer well, simply because resource management can be hard to adjust to a lot more than taking a little more or less damage. That said, a 'creative' difficulty will be eventually added, perhaps with infinite light constantly.
5. Redstone is used as an option, not a necessity in games, hence why its uses are creating complicated structures you can do without and a compass which points to spawn, which might not even be of use to you, and why it takes so long to mine. All this is to add an extra layer to the game that you don't have to explore.
6. Glass shouldn't be used in lanterns, in my opinion, simply because having them largely dependant on glass, thus sand, thus on how close you built to a beach seems sort of dodgy in my opinion, as those awesome mountain-top bases will become a lot less awesome if bathed in darkness due to being 20 minutes from the nearest sandy beach.
GENERATION 18: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment
(__/) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your
(='.'=) signature to gain world domination!
There are other ways to block of caves, like placing a straight wall of dirtor cobblestone there, and even then, the old torches will still be on the walls.
Does anyone have any idea about the timelimit on the torches?
Would it be like a couple of hours or something similar to that of a real torch or?
And remember; its not that easy to obtain Iron on the first night of a new game in Minecraft. From memory you need a piece of Iron as well as obtaining the obvious flint (to which is simple enough to get). Mining iron in the first day can be a little difficult.
Do you think Notch has done something about a simple case like this? Example ~ more iron ore or perhaps bring it a little closer to the surface of the world or entrance to a cave?
Walking around a mountainous area with a good bit of attention payed to your surroundings should net you that one iron needed to begin with. Anyway, ideally, when a torch is placed, it will start of lit, but collecting a placed torch will give you an unlit torch (in a seperate inventory slot), which can then be placed and relit. This would allow you to survive without relighting torches, albeit in an inconvenient and costly manner.