Think of it this way - assuming when your touching the ground and the acceleration is applied to you, no 'friction' slows you, and the terrain is flat with a vortex in range of the player at all times, all that happens is the player is accelerated towards the center of the vortex on the horizontal plane but not on the vertical (conventional gravity, 20ms-2 cancels perfectly all vertical components of the vortex's gravity), leading to the player just being dragged along the ground until it reaches below the vortex, momentum carries the player a few blocks further before the acceleration reverses the direction and the same thing happens over and over again.
Assuming friction is present (if not, it would be trivial to do an 'is touching ground' check to apply friction), and the acceleration of the vortex is upped a small amount, the player would be slowly drawn towards the vortex along the ground before the vertical component of the vortex' acceleration overcomes the 20ms-2 conventional gravity and the player starts to slowly lift off the ground and equally slowly accelerate upwards and enter an orbit. By timing (this timing comes intuitively, mind you, like swinging on a swing) use of the movement keys, the player can enter an unstable orbit and free themselves.
Another point about the 20ms-2 acceleration is that the 'jump puzzles' you've suggested wouldn't work effectively - you would jump, start slightly falling before getting into the field and continue your forward journey but also your fall (you just wouldn't accelerate any more), and if came in at the vortex from the top, its acceleration and gravity combined would accelerate you downwards and fling you out of the vortex at that speed, probably right into whatever ground is below it!
It's not a problem, I appreciate the feedback you're giving as it only helps solidify the concept. I won't change the value just yet, however, I will when I get more feedback as to what value you would suggest. 25, 30, 40? etc.
gravity wells are a good idea for a different game or a mod. they are far too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition into the theme of items that are being added currently.
what do i mean by 'game changing'? was it not stated earlier that these could be collected and placed?
- walking becomes obsolete with some simple mechanical creations (horizontal escalators)
B = any block
W = gravity well
BBBBBB
BWWWWB
BBBBBB
- for that matter boats, minecarts, sprinting, swimming, pistons, redstone repeaters all becomes obsolete with some creative building.
- the advanced mechanics behind gravity wells creates an infinite amount of possible mechanisms, which may or may not be a good thing, a (possible) infinite amount of memory problems with an infinite amount of headaches trying to make these mechanisms 'controllable' (i am still able to create whirlpools in a lake that cannot be 'fixed' without admin intervention)
im not saying its a bad idea, im saying that this may be better suited for a mod. gravity wells imo are infinitely too OP in the right creative hands, which, after some time and experimentation, these ideas can be documented and taught to anyone with a pea brain.
gravity wells are a good idea for a different game or a mod. they are far too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition into the theme of items that are being added currently.
what do i mean by 'game changing'? was it not stated earlier that these could be collected and placed?
- walking becomes obsolete with some simple mechanical creations (horizontal escalators)
B = any block
W = gravity well
BBBBBB
BWWWWB
BBBBBB
- for that matter boats, minecarts, sprinting, swimming, pistons, redstone repeaters all becomes obsolete with some creative building.
- the advanced mechanics behind gravity wells creates an infinite amount of possible mechanisms, which may or may not be a good thing, a (possible) infinite amount of memory problems with an infinite amount of headaches trying to make these mechanisms 'controllable' (i am still able to create whirlpools in a lake that cannot be 'fixed' without admin intervention)
im not saying its a bad idea, im saying that this may be better suited for a mod. gravity wells imo are infinitely too OP in the right creative hands, which, after some time and experimentation, these ideas can be documented and taught to anyone.
That's the fun of it. The concept of infinite problems with finite resources ensures that it requires a strong engineering mind, placement, and practice to use them to their full potential. I'd say that you'd get more problems from redstone. Either way, thanks for elaborating. I'll look into the problems you have described though I don't see anything but positive affects coming from these blocks.
That's the fun of it. The concept of infinite problems with finite resources ensures that it requires a strong engineering mind, placement, and practice to use them to their full potential. I'd say that you'd get more problems from redstone. Either way, thanks for elaborating. I'll look into the problems you have described though I don't see anything but positive affects coming from these blocks.
i see where you're coming from. its a good idea. there are a lot of possibilities with this.
i just hope you have 16gb of ram or more. :smile.gif:
i still think its going to be super system intensive. think about how much ram is used just to load the terrain for a far render distance. yes, its one thing for water and lava to 'appear' to move when it really isn't because the surface is a gif (or whatever notch uses), but its a completely different thing to have actual blocks moving in some kind of a gravity mechanism.
i still say ram issue no matter how much they clean up the code. unless the gravity wells are used very sparingly.
the other issue you may want to think about is the fact that it slams the door on future content. by having the power of gravity to create pretty much anything you want, what else does that leave room for? i dont think notch wants to close the book on minecraft just yet. a game like spore where you aspire to roam the galaxy in a spaceship from an amoeba is possible because the game has a definite start and end. minecraft does not yet, and in order for notch to milk this game dry, i don't see him putting a definite end on here just yet, or giving the player an ability that makes all future updates appear bland.
i still think its going to be super system intensive. think about how much ram is used just to load the terrain for a far render distance. yes, its one thing for water and lava to 'appear' to move when it really isn't because the surface is a gif (or whatever notch uses), but its a completely different thing to have actual blocks moving in some kind of a gravity mechanism.
The blocks do not use gifs. They use 3 frames found in terrain.png. Also, gravity would be a simple vector calculation. Since a 3D vector requires 3 plots for position and 3 plots for direction, that's 6 variables that objects already have. Simply having the acceleration point toward the center of the well is easy enough.
If the game can handle the particle effects of exp orbs, I'm sure it can handle a handful of objects spinning around gravity wells in synchronous orbits.
i still say ram issue no matter how much they clean up the code. unless the gravity wells are used very sparingly.
Gravity wells aren't intended to be entirely common, they cannot be created, only found; and have the same rarity as finding a diamond in a chunk.
the other issue you may want to think about is the fact that it slams the door on future content.
Why would it limit it? Why can't content add upon the nether rifts?
by having the power of gravity to create pretty much anything you want, what else does that leave room for? i dont think notch wants to close the book on minecraft just yet.
Also, who says that this suggestion was intended for immediate inclusion? What if this was the final bit of content he wished to add?
A game like spore where you aspire to roam the galaxy in a spaceship from an amoeba is possible because the game has a definite start and end. minecraft does not yet, and in order for notch to milk this game dry, i don't see him putting a definite end on here just yet, or giving the player an ability that makes all future updates appear bland.
This game is made, not by the prospective updates, but by the creativity of the player using the system. It's like RPG Maker except 3D and fully-flexible. You create your villages, your castles, your mines, your whatever.
Future updates are nice, but I don't see "closing the door to future expansions" to be a very reliable argument in this case. It simply seems like a last failing argument against something you know you want to support.
i still think its going to be super system intensive. think about how much ram is used just to load the terrain for a far render distance. yes, its one thing for water and lava to 'appear' to move when it really isn't because the surface is a gif (or whatever notch uses), but its a completely different thing to have actual blocks moving in some kind of a gravity mechanism.
i still say ram issue no matter how much they clean up the code. unless the gravity wells are used very sparingly.
It's simple vector addition on entities (dropped items, mobs, players, dropped blocks), not terrain blocks. A constant acceleration system is not an overly complex calculation (it already exists for the XP ball collection animation) - this isn't an n-body gravity simulation with hundreds upon thousands of particles - each entity in range has its velocity/motion vector added to by the constant acceleration in the direction of the warp. There is no object-on-object force like with a gravity equation.
Oh, and the only (extremely minimal) extra load it would place is on the CPU - loading thousands of blocks into RAM uses RAM, not performing a couple of simple equations.
Future updates are nice, but I don't see "closing the door to future expansions" to be a very reliable argument in this case. It simply seems like a last failing argument against something you know you want to support.
first, i didn't say i don't want to support it. almost every post i've made here states that I like the idea.
second, what exactly could you possibly add to minecraft that would be relevant and exciting when you've created:
- horizontal escalators that move you everywhere (walking becomes obsolete)
- a perfectly working 100% monster protection system for your base (protecting your building becomes obsolete)
- a tool that allows for almost instant digging i.e. displacement of blocks (pickaxes and shovels become obsolete)
- tools that combine gravity wells and redstone that can create a building, structure, mountain, or tunnel 'instantly' by displacing blocks and placing them into an ordered fashion (manually building structures becomes obsolete)
- tools that give 100% protection from monsters while outside of your house (think of 360 degree rotating dispensers, protection from monsters outside of your base becomes obsolete)
- 100% protection from lava (dying from lava becomes obsolete, just displace the lava out of your way)
- i believe i read that the gravity wells could be setup to have a rubber band effect. (sprinting, boats, and minecarts become obsolete)
i could go on and on and on and on but lack the patients. theoretically you could render every single aspect of minecraft as it is now completely obsolete. that was my original point a couple of posts back. it turns minecraft into a completely different game and is too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition to the current items that are being added.
the reason i'm so against this being officially ingame is that by adding gravity wells, you have basically added into the game 'perpetual electricity' or an everlasting electric engine for those that can't make the analogy. i dare anyone to ask an electrical or mechanical engineer 'what things can be built with a perpetual engine'. they'll laugh at you. think of anything on earth that can be created using steel, an engine, and an infinite supply of electricity. you will then be able to build it in minecraft. it becomes way too game changing. every single thing becomes automated. and then, you end up standing around and getting bored watching everything you've created.
i salute anyone who makes this into a mod and will probably try it out. i think mod status is where this idea belongs, not officially ingame.
update: i've edited this post about 20 times to word it exactly how i want it. i'm done updating.
I'll see how well I can defend against the list of points made against the suggestion's inclusion into the game. You have added a pretty large list but I want to see if I can satisfy you on even one of them.
- horizontal escalators that move you everywhere (walking becomes obsolete)
This ignores the fact that a given player would only have a pre-planned and pre-scripted means of travel. How would the player compensate for branching turns along the pre-scripted escalator? For the duration of the run along the escalator, the player would move fast to the point of rendering walking obsolete, however the player must still continue applying a horizontal velocity (IE. Walking) for optimal effect.
- a perfectly working 100% monster protection system for your base (protecting your building becomes obsolete)
Assuming that obtaining 5 or so of these items wasn't a complete hassle, I'd be inclined to agree. The way that these things whip the enemies around and throw them eludes to me that they don't make the base secure but instead allows different avenues of NPC attack. As is, a well-made base is practically protection-free assuming the walls are high enough and there's enough overhangs. I mean, sure, the wells would be of great assistance, but in the right hands; they are a tool and not an overpowered mechanic awash in a sea of overpowered mechanics.
- a tool that allows for almost instant digging i.e. displacement of blocks (pickaxes and shovels become obsolete)
Not sure I follow on this one. The explicit limitation of gravity wells was that it could not affect placed blocks like signs, dirt, stone, snow, gravel, nor sand. Even blocks "affected by gravity" would not be affected by the nether rift. It was only destroyed and harvest ready spinning blocks on the ground which would be affected including mobs, the player, and various mob drops.
As a resource consideration, exp orbs would not be affected by the wells.
- tools that combine gravity wells and redstone that can create a building, structure, mountain, or tunnel 'instantly' by displacing blocks and placing them into an ordered fashion (manually building structures becomes obsolete)
How would it? It does not affect placed blocks. If you're referring to a new speculative item which would than I'd say the new item should be a mod. The fear of a potential resource is a foolhardy reason to completely deny the resource completely.
- tools that give 100% protection from monsters while outside of your house (think of 360 degree rotating dispensers, protection from monsters outside of your base becomes obsolete)
Except that arrows are finite, therefore the ability to protect is still based off of the player and the lucky kill of a skeleton or two.
- 100% protection from lava (dying from lava becomes obsolete, just displace the lava out of your way)
Gravity wells do not affect the flow of lava, they will, however, allow the player to float above the lava for a period of time.
- i believe i read that the gravity wells could be setup to have a rubber band effect. (sprinting, boats, and minecarts become obsolete)
You speak of concepts like walking, sprinting, and other concepts to be obsolete with this which frankly baffles me. This requires that every potential direction you will ever walk in the game (even unexplored) has been fully fitted with nether rifts for easy travel.
I'll make a list of what wells CAN and CANNOT do as proposed in the ORIGINAL POST and as discussed ever since.
Gravity wells cannot be crafted. They are a rare find in the nether. Acquiring even one takes a bit of skill. Acquiring 5 or more takes significant patience. Acquiring a full stack means you have spent significant time in the nether without dying while fighting ghasts and zpm and fighting the gravity-altering effects of the very items you're attempting to harvest without being flung into lava.
Gravity wells do NOT affect placed blocks, only free-floating objects. Exp orbs (I'll add this in), sand, and gravel are placed blocks regardless of their "gravity-obeying" traits.
Gravity wells will only function when connected to redstone granted that the energy provided is not diminished
Gravity wells will NOT create a hostile environment, they will only manipulate the gravity in any area they are placed.
The problems you pointed out for making walking, jumping and other concepts obsolete only occur when the entire natural world is filled with hundreds if not thousands of gravity wells. Even then, the player has limited control over their character during the entire leg of travel, they can't easily change direction, they can't easily plan their course, and the entire world becomes as indistinguishable as the Nether. The scenario you provide is for a player whom has abused (cheated) the items to a point where he deserves those abilities to become obsolete and he deserves everything that happens to him. A common given player on survival will really only have 5~10 of these in a given world to perform their acts.
second, what exactly could you possibly add to minecraft that would be relevant and exciting when you've created:
- horizontal escalators that move you everywhere (walking becomes obsolete)
What about exploring new land? By that logic, walking is already obsolete, because of Minecarts, or ladders are obsolete, because of piston elevators. Walking->Sprinting->Coal Minecarts->Powered Rails->Gravity wells is a progression, each step harder to achieve than the last. Remember, gravity wells would be hard to use, because you'd need to wire them to activate and deactivate at the right time so you don't just end up stuck in them. And gravity well paths would not be fit for all occasions, like walking inside of a building or through the streets of a city.
- a perfectly working 100% monster protection system for your base (protecting your building becomes obsolete)
Lava moat? 3 block high cobblestone wall with an overhang? 3 block deep, 3 block wide pit with soul sand or glass on the side? Making base defenses with gravity wells is harder than the 100% protections that already exist...
- tools that combine gravity wells and redstone that can create a building, structure, mountain, or tunnel 'instantly' by displacing blocks and placing them into an ordered fashion (manually building structures becomes obsolete)
Yeah, because that's just something every Minecraft player can do. Also, it would only move sand and gravel, and possibly only when they are falling.
- tools that give 100% protection from monsters while outside of your house (think of 360 degree rotating dispensers, protection from monsters outside of your base becomes obsolete)
What's to stop these dispensers from shooting you?
- i believe i read that the gravity wells could be setup to have a rubber band effect. (sprinting, boats, and minecarts become obsolete)
Sprinting is good for exploring new land. Sure, gravity wells could help the player explore land faster, but only after they've progressed enough, and even then it's unpredictable and has a chance of seriously wounding or killing the player (from falling into lava or teleporting to the side of a cliff). Minecarts are a good step up to travel faster at a medium price, or for those that like the scenery. Boats are good for exploring new oceans and rivers.
i could go on and on and on and on but lack the patients. theoretically you could render every single aspect of minecraft as it is now completely obsolete. that was my original point a couple of posts back. it turns minecraft into a completely different game and is too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition to the current items that are being added.
I haven't seen a single aspect of Minecraft you could truly render obsolete...
the reason i'm so against this being officially ingame is that by adding gravity wells, you have basically added into the game 'perpetual electricity' or an everlasting electric engine for those that can't make the analogy. i dare anyone to ask an electrical or mechanical engineer 'what things can be built with a perpetual engine'. they'll laugh at you. think of anything on earth that can be created using steel, an engine, and an infinite supply of electricity. you will then be able to build it in minecraft. it becomes way too game changing. every single thing becomes automated. and then, you end up standing around and getting bored watching everything you've created.
i salute anyone who makes this into a mod and will probably try it out. i think mod status is where this idea belongs, not officially ingame.
update: i've edited this post about 20 times to word it exactly how i want it. i'm done updating.
Wouldn't it be awesome? To give Minecraft infinite potential? To be able to do anything you can dream of with enough creativity and thought? Of course, gravity wells don't unlock infinte potential. But they unlock more potential than any other suggestion I've seen, arguably even pistons.
The blocks do not use gifs. They use 3 frames found in terrain.png. Also, gravity would be a simple vector calculation. Since a 3D vector requires 3 plots for position and 3 plots for direction, that's 6 variables that objects already have. Simply having the acceleration point toward the center of the well is easy enough.
If the game can handle the particle effects of exp orbs, I'm sure it can handle a handful of objects spinning around gravity wells in synchronous orbits.
The reason MC doesn't allow more than a certain amount of mobs to be naturally spawned is because many computers wouldn't be able to handle more than a hundred or so mobs worth of physics calculations, AIs, and coordinate updates without noticeable lag. Objects orbiting a well wouldn't be as resource intensive as a mob, so most computers could handle a few hundred at a time easily, but it would be too easy to crash a server by breaking a chest full of items over a gravity well. Sure, you could disable picking up and placing wells, like is often done for TNT, but this limits what new people to the server can do and then they could just go to the nether to find a natural or a well a higher rank placed and place a chest, dump their inventory into it, and destroy it. Completely disabling wells would stop so many awesome things from being made in the servers that disabled it, while those that didn't would be frequently crashed.
Gravity wells aren't intended to be entirely common, they cannot be created, only found; and have the same rarity as finding a diamond in a chunk.
Diamond is still a little too common for something that only spawns in air and therefore mostly plain sight.
Oh, and one last thing to add: another use for travel. You'd place a few gravity wells as if to slingshot yourself, set up the redstone correctly, then throw and ender pearl. Since would take a while to land, you could leisurely take down the setup, chop down a tree or too, then suddenly be teleported hundreds of blocks away. There is and always will be the issue of chunk loading when it comes to any method of faster exploration, but it wouldn't be too bad for an average computer.
I'll throw this in on top of what has already been stated;
Any of the movement assistant methods that use this kind of thing are fairly complex creations, requiring proper timing (with redstone) to work effectively - so no, they don't render walking obsolete. Mine carts are still a more efficient and effective method.
They don't open up some hidden reserve of infinite superior solutions, they only complement or offer alternatives to existing ones. Not all of these alternatives would be as, or more effective than the traditional solution, sound familiar? (hint: pistons)
Hmm I actually quite like this idea. It is a bit out-of-the-ordinary (in a good way :3), I can see that you've put some good thought into it and I can actually see this being implemented into the game, and really fitting in :smile.gif:. Very well done :biggrin.gif:.
Essentially, yes ironbran, I understand your sentiment against gravity wells, but I hope you'll understand why I (and other members (thanks for the support <3)) feel these worries are nothing to really sweat.
It's not always a design interpretation problem. If you poorly describe an idea than it is translated poorly; sorry.
Let me fix that for you.
You wish to have a hand-held gun (I assume one which uses a nether rift) with the ability to pull and push objects. Left-click pulls and right-click pushes.
Is that right?
Yes that is it sorry for my bad english im a brazilian xD well as you said and a its more like a gravity gun
*snip*
Oh, and one last thing to add: another use for travel. You'd place a few gravity wells as if to slingshot yourself, set up the redstone correctly, then throw and ender pearl. Since would take a while to land, you could leisurely take down the setup, chop down a tree or too, then suddenly be teleported hundreds of blocks away. There is and always will be the issue of chunk loading when it comes to any method of faster exploration, but it wouldn't be too bad for an average computer.
I can imagine that. For over 9 chunk travel, you'd need multiple waypoints, and, thus, multiple Ender Pearls.
Also, yes. Enderpearl travel will be much more broken with the implementation of nether rifts, the problem is getting the rifts to operate correctly. May I suggest dispensers with rifts at key locations? You can decorate it as a teleportation chamber for added effect.
Assuming friction is present (if not, it would be trivial to do an 'is touching ground' check to apply friction), and the acceleration of the vortex is upped a small amount, the player would be slowly drawn towards the vortex along the ground before the vertical component of the vortex' acceleration overcomes the 20ms-2 conventional gravity and the player starts to slowly lift off the ground and equally slowly accelerate upwards and enter an orbit. By timing (this timing comes intuitively, mind you, like swinging on a swing) use of the movement keys, the player can enter an unstable orbit and free themselves.
Another point about the 20ms-2 acceleration is that the 'jump puzzles' you've suggested wouldn't work effectively - you would jump, start slightly falling before getting into the field and continue your forward journey but also your fall (you just wouldn't accelerate any more), and if came in at the vortex from the top, its acceleration and gravity combined would accelerate you downwards and fling you out of the vortex at that speed, probably right into whatever ground is below it!
Gee I'm giving out a lot of 2 cents,
Frohman
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use puffery much?
to comment on the original post, you put a lot of time and effort into it, however, you've completely changed minecraft into something different.
How so? Please elaborate.
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gravity wells are a good idea for a different game or a mod. they are far too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition into the theme of items that are being added currently.
what do i mean by 'game changing'? was it not stated earlier that these could be collected and placed?
- walking becomes obsolete with some simple mechanical creations (horizontal escalators)
B = any block
W = gravity well
BBBBBB
BWWWWB
BBBBBB
- for that matter boats, minecarts, sprinting, swimming, pistons, redstone repeaters all becomes obsolete with some creative building.
- the advanced mechanics behind gravity wells creates an infinite amount of possible mechanisms, which may or may not be a good thing, a (possible) infinite amount of memory problems with an infinite amount of headaches trying to make these mechanisms 'controllable' (i am still able to create whirlpools in a lake that cannot be 'fixed' without admin intervention)
im not saying its a bad idea, im saying that this may be better suited for a mod. gravity wells imo are infinitely too OP in the right creative hands, which, after some time and experimentation, these ideas can be documented and taught to anyone with a pea brain.
That's the fun of it. The concept of infinite problems with finite resources ensures that it requires a strong engineering mind, placement, and practice to use them to their full potential. I'd say that you'd get more problems from redstone. Either way, thanks for elaborating. I'll look into the problems you have described though I don't see anything but positive affects coming from these blocks.
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i see where you're coming from. its a good idea. there are a lot of possibilities with this.
i just hope you have 16gb of ram or more. :smile.gif:
I doubt it'll be that system intensive. IIRC Notch is optimizing the code so the 4GB necessary currently will be rewritten to 2GB.
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i still think its going to be super system intensive. think about how much ram is used just to load the terrain for a far render distance. yes, its one thing for water and lava to 'appear' to move when it really isn't because the surface is a gif (or whatever notch uses), but its a completely different thing to have actual blocks moving in some kind of a gravity mechanism.
i still say ram issue no matter how much they clean up the code. unless the gravity wells are used very sparingly.
the other issue you may want to think about is the fact that it slams the door on future content. by having the power of gravity to create pretty much anything you want, what else does that leave room for? i dont think notch wants to close the book on minecraft just yet. a game like spore where you aspire to roam the galaxy in a spaceship from an amoeba is possible because the game has a definite start and end. minecraft does not yet, and in order for notch to milk this game dry, i don't see him putting a definite end on here just yet, or giving the player an ability that makes all future updates appear bland.
If the game can handle the particle effects of exp orbs, I'm sure it can handle a handful of objects spinning around gravity wells in synchronous orbits.
Gravity wells aren't intended to be entirely common, they cannot be created, only found; and have the same rarity as finding a diamond in a chunk.
Why would it limit it? Why can't content add upon the nether rifts?
Also, who says that this suggestion was intended for immediate inclusion? What if this was the final bit of content he wished to add?
This game is made, not by the prospective updates, but by the creativity of the player using the system. It's like RPG Maker except 3D and fully-flexible. You create your villages, your castles, your mines, your whatever.
Future updates are nice, but I don't see "closing the door to future expansions" to be a very reliable argument in this case. It simply seems like a last failing argument against something you know you want to support.
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It's simple vector addition on entities (dropped items, mobs, players, dropped blocks), not terrain blocks. A constant acceleration system is not an overly complex calculation (it already exists for the XP ball collection animation) - this isn't an n-body gravity simulation with hundreds upon thousands of particles - each entity in range has its velocity/motion vector added to by the constant acceleration in the direction of the warp. There is no object-on-object force like with a gravity equation.
Oh, and the only (extremely minimal) extra load it would place is on the CPU - loading thousands of blocks into RAM uses RAM, not performing a couple of simple equations.
first, i didn't say i don't want to support it. almost every post i've made here states that I like the idea.
second, what exactly could you possibly add to minecraft that would be relevant and exciting when you've created:
- horizontal escalators that move you everywhere (walking becomes obsolete)
- a perfectly working 100% monster protection system for your base (protecting your building becomes obsolete)
- a tool that allows for almost instant digging i.e. displacement of blocks (pickaxes and shovels become obsolete)
- tools that combine gravity wells and redstone that can create a building, structure, mountain, or tunnel 'instantly' by displacing blocks and placing them into an ordered fashion (manually building structures becomes obsolete)
- tools that give 100% protection from monsters while outside of your house (think of 360 degree rotating dispensers, protection from monsters outside of your base becomes obsolete)
- 100% protection from lava (dying from lava becomes obsolete, just displace the lava out of your way)
- i believe i read that the gravity wells could be setup to have a rubber band effect. (sprinting, boats, and minecarts become obsolete)
i could go on and on and on and on but lack the patients. theoretically you could render every single aspect of minecraft as it is now completely obsolete. that was my original point a couple of posts back. it turns minecraft into a completely different game and is too 'game changing' to be a realistic addition to the current items that are being added.
the reason i'm so against this being officially ingame is that by adding gravity wells, you have basically added into the game 'perpetual electricity' or an everlasting electric engine for those that can't make the analogy. i dare anyone to ask an electrical or mechanical engineer 'what things can be built with a perpetual engine'. they'll laugh at you. think of anything on earth that can be created using steel, an engine, and an infinite supply of electricity. you will then be able to build it in minecraft. it becomes way too game changing. every single thing becomes automated. and then, you end up standing around and getting bored watching everything you've created.
i salute anyone who makes this into a mod and will probably try it out. i think mod status is where this idea belongs, not officially ingame.
update: i've edited this post about 20 times to word it exactly how i want it. i'm done updating.
This ignores the fact that a given player would only have a pre-planned and pre-scripted means of travel. How would the player compensate for branching turns along the pre-scripted escalator? For the duration of the run along the escalator, the player would move fast to the point of rendering walking obsolete, however the player must still continue applying a horizontal velocity (IE. Walking) for optimal effect.
Assuming that obtaining 5 or so of these items wasn't a complete hassle, I'd be inclined to agree. The way that these things whip the enemies around and throw them eludes to me that they don't make the base secure but instead allows different avenues of NPC attack. As is, a well-made base is practically protection-free assuming the walls are high enough and there's enough overhangs. I mean, sure, the wells would be of great assistance, but in the right hands; they are a tool and not an overpowered mechanic awash in a sea of overpowered mechanics.
Not sure I follow on this one. The explicit limitation of gravity wells was that it could not affect placed blocks like signs, dirt, stone, snow, gravel, nor sand. Even blocks "affected by gravity" would not be affected by the nether rift. It was only destroyed and harvest ready spinning blocks on the ground which would be affected including mobs, the player, and various mob drops.
As a resource consideration, exp orbs would not be affected by the wells.
How would it? It does not affect placed blocks. If you're referring to a new speculative item which would than I'd say the new item should be a mod. The fear of a potential resource is a foolhardy reason to completely deny the resource completely.
Except that arrows are finite, therefore the ability to protect is still based off of the player and the lucky kill of a skeleton or two.
Gravity wells do not affect the flow of lava, they will, however, allow the player to float above the lava for a period of time.
You speak of concepts like walking, sprinting, and other concepts to be obsolete with this which frankly baffles me. This requires that every potential direction you will ever walk in the game (even unexplored) has been fully fitted with nether rifts for easy travel.
I'll make a list of what wells CAN and CANNOT do as proposed in the ORIGINAL POST and as discussed ever since.
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What about exploring new land? By that logic, walking is already obsolete, because of Minecarts, or ladders are obsolete, because of piston elevators. Walking->Sprinting->Coal Minecarts->Powered Rails->Gravity wells is a progression, each step harder to achieve than the last. Remember, gravity wells would be hard to use, because you'd need to wire them to activate and deactivate at the right time so you don't just end up stuck in them. And gravity well paths would not be fit for all occasions, like walking inside of a building or through the streets of a city.
Lava moat? 3 block high cobblestone wall with an overhang? 3 block deep, 3 block wide pit with soul sand or glass on the side? Making base defenses with gravity wells is harder than the 100% protections that already exist...
How does this allow for such a tool?
Yeah, because that's just something every Minecraft player can do. Also, it would only move sand and gravel, and possibly only when they are falling.
What's to stop these dispensers from shooting you?
It wouldn't do anything to lava...
Sprinting is good for exploring new land. Sure, gravity wells could help the player explore land faster, but only after they've progressed enough, and even then it's unpredictable and has a chance of seriously wounding or killing the player (from falling into lava or teleporting to the side of a cliff). Minecarts are a good step up to travel faster at a medium price, or for those that like the scenery. Boats are good for exploring new oceans and rivers.
I haven't seen a single aspect of Minecraft you could truly render obsolete...
Wouldn't it be awesome? To give Minecraft infinite potential? To be able to do anything you can dream of with enough creativity and thought? Of course, gravity wells don't unlock infinte potential. But they unlock more potential than any other suggestion I've seen, arguably even pistons.
The reason MC doesn't allow more than a certain amount of mobs to be naturally spawned is because many computers wouldn't be able to handle more than a hundred or so mobs worth of physics calculations, AIs, and coordinate updates without noticeable lag. Objects orbiting a well wouldn't be as resource intensive as a mob, so most computers could handle a few hundred at a time easily, but it would be too easy to crash a server by breaking a chest full of items over a gravity well. Sure, you could disable picking up and placing wells, like is often done for TNT, but this limits what new people to the server can do and then they could just go to the nether to find a natural or a well a higher rank placed and place a chest, dump their inventory into it, and destroy it. Completely disabling wells would stop so many awesome things from being made in the servers that disabled it, while those that didn't would be frequently crashed.
Diamond is still a little too common for something that only spawns in air and therefore mostly plain sight.
Oh, and one last thing to add: another use for travel. You'd place a few gravity wells as if to slingshot yourself, set up the redstone correctly, then throw and ender pearl. Since would take a while to land, you could leisurely take down the setup, chop down a tree or too, then suddenly be teleported hundreds of blocks away. There is and always will be the issue of chunk loading when it comes to any method of faster exploration, but it wouldn't be too bad for an average computer.
Pipes
Any of the movement assistant methods that use this kind of thing are fairly complex creations, requiring proper timing (with redstone) to work effectively - so no, they don't render walking obsolete. Mine carts are still a more efficient and effective method.
They don't open up some hidden reserve of infinite superior solutions, they only complement or offer alternatives to existing ones. Not all of these alternatives would be as, or more effective than the traditional solution, sound familiar? (hint: pistons)
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Yes that is it sorry for my bad english im a brazilian xD well as you said and a its more like a gravity gun
*facepalm* fishing rods don't pull blocks
joke:don't worry blocks come back! (whisper) no zei don't
Geno: Blahblahblah, random sentence.
Firebrand is this color.
Shovel Knight is this color.
Memnon is this color
Cinder is this color.
Glacius is this color.
Jago is this color.
The Batter (or just Batter) is this color
Heatshade is this col- I CHOOSE MY OWN COLORS, BABY!!!
Heatshade, please.
...Fine.
Anyway...
I am this color.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Therealadrenalinerush/
I can imagine that. For over 9 chunk travel, you'd need multiple waypoints, and, thus, multiple Ender Pearls.
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